Table Games I'm a sucker, a lot of $$ got sucked out on sucker bets

Soooo, I totally get that carny games are not what you want to play if you look at gambling as an endeavor upon which you're really trying to make some money. But I look at gambling as just something I do fun for fun. I enjoy 3 card, Let it Ride, etc.

But man, this past trip to Golden Nugget really got the best of me, especially at 3 card. I'm a $10 to $15 player on anything, sometimes pressing to $25 if I'm on a good run. As I said in my trip report, the 3 card at GN has all these side bets that go with it.

Besides the typical pair plus, there's a progressive bonus, a six card bonus, and a bet called "Diamonds" that pays on 3 diamonds or more between your hand and the dealer's. If you have cards to play the hand, you're shelling out $30 per hand. Yes, I know you don't "have to," but self-discipline is difficult when the rest of the table is bought in and you've had a few drinks. I went through $200 in less than 30 minutes.

Blackjack, at least at the GN, was not better. It's one thing to pay at 6-5, I get how common that is, but they make you do a side bet of $2 to spin the bonus wheel whenever you get a blackjack. So now you're spending $12 to win $10. That's a losing proposition for sure.

In sum, a big lesson that I thought I knew, but apparently forgot, was relearned this week. I like the GN a lot as a property. And I like playing 3 card. But next time there's no way in hell I'm doing all those side bets. And if I want to play blackjack, I'm going to any of the Stephens properties where I don't have to do the side bet and they pay blackjack at 3-2.

 

I hear you. I'm one of those folks that used to frown on the carny games, and stuck to blackjack and craps. However, as minimums have gone up in the past few years, and with the availability of the $5 games at GN, I found it a good way in the evening hours during my trip last November to kill time relatively cheaply. Particularly since every other table during those hours anyplace else downtown during those hours seemed to be $15 or higher. I'd play $5 craps during the day at DTG. $5 3CP was available at DTG even at night, but I'd find myself moseying back to GN, where I was staying, to play the carny games. However, as I said in your TR thread, I still see playing 3CP as a way to just kill time and enjoy the company of the other players, and gamble it in the most conservative way possible, just sticking to the ante and play. Not even the pair plus lol!

When I go out next, it'll be tempting to jump on the $10 3/2 tables at the Stevens properties. Problem is that I enjoy playing the $5 craps tables at DTG during the day, and the 3/2 tables at those places probably still go to $15 at night. DTG has a $5 3/2 table, but deal the cards from a CSM. I find playing blackjack just using basic strategy boring. I use a rudimentary count system I read out in a Frank Scoblete book some years ago. Its not as powerful as some of the traditional counting system, but its something to keep me engaged.

 

John Mehaffey just did a post on his blog where he reported that the 6/5 side bet BJ game at Golden Nugget has the worst odds of any BJ game in Las Vegas.

 

Those side bets, especially the ones that are or start at $1, also have the effect of reducing dealer tips.

 

My math may be a bit off but I’d be more concerned about house advantage over table limits. An an average multi shoe deck 3/2 BJ game like the ones you see at Golden Gate or the D at $25 a hand are going to have a similar expected loss than a $5 three card poker game at the Golden Nugget. This is before even accounting for all the crazy side bets which make the 3CP at $5 even worse.

I’m also assuming your understanding of basic strategy is similar for both. I believe you’re more penalized for a lack of knowledge at the 3CP game. I say play whatever one you have more fun at, either is a losing proposition. However whichever one you play try to have a good grasp at basic strategy.

 

What is the minimum bet for 3CP that you see or play?Thx.

 

The carny games at the GN have a $5 minimum bet.

I think about this too and ask myself, "why am I playing this when games like craps and blackjack (especially 3/2) have such lower house advantages?" One of the ways I somewhat justify it, aside from avoiding any bet I don't have to make (including pair plus and the side bets), is taking into account the speed of the game. I'm not sure what the average time it takes to deal a hand of 3CP to a full table, but I would think it has to be at least two, if not three, minutes (which means you are getting 20-30 hands per hour). Compared to probably closer to 50-60 hands for blackjack. Craps to me is a little slower in that each roll doesn't necessarily result in a betting outcome.

 

I played for about an hour at the GN back during Memorial Day. I normally don't mind if a specific table forces you to place that side bet, but ALL the 6/5 tables were like that and it disgusted me.
I even like playing craps at GN, but this kind of stuff makes me not want to go back until they remove that stupid rule.

 

There hasn't been any playable blackjack at GN for quite some time (except in their HL area... $100/hand). The good news is (as you've already noted), there is plenty of decent-to-very good blackjack to find downtown.
One area where the Nugget holds a clear advantage over the rest of downtown: All of their 'carny-games' have a $5 min., and they have several tables open of each game - pretty much all of the time!
The carny side-bets at the Nugget is another story - everything's $5!
You can find 3-card with a $1 6-card bonus & a $1 mini-royal progressive, at 4-Queens & Plaza... El-Co has their 6-card bonus at $1... no other side bet there.
Good luck!

 

When I was there last November, there were $25 and 50 tables in HL at GN. At one point I think one of the tables on the main floor was $25 with normal rules.

But, as you said, you can play for $10-15 at Derek's places.

 

I'm a fan of LIR and 3CP, was intimidated by others though like UTH or MS Stud. For help I just picked up The Ultimate Report by James Grosjean. Book is brand new, had it pre-ordered and just got it about 2 weeks ago. Lots of good info so far, full analyses plus EZ basic strategies for each game. Just wanted to share for those that like "definitive guides".

 

worst thing that can happen is you get a hot streak on sucker bets and never lay off them again.

 

I will play a progressive side bet on three card but that's it. I have made a habit of not playing at tables with lots of side bets so I can avoid a "if only" disaster.

 

IIRC these places are all at least $10 minimum for 3CP last I checked. Only other place I've seen $5 is Downtown Grand.

 

I’ll second this. I like the basic strategy info but seeing, in black and white, how big the disadvantage is…yikes!! I’m not playing LIR again after reading the book.

 

Despite the relatively poor odds, I actually took a bit of a liking to three-card poker for a number of reasons...

- Abundance of $5 minimum games which are much more approachable (IMO) than $15 or $25 blackjack games from a bankroll management perspective. Also no doubles or splits to worry about as far as needing to put more money on the table to make the optimal play

- Slower speed of play as mentioned above, which doesn't just result in fewer wagers per hour but can also be a lot more fun if you're just looking to push some cards and chips around at a more mild pace

- Since you can't immediately see other players' cards, there's a bit of suspense around wondering what other players have all while having no clue what the dealer has... whereas in blackjack you know 50% of what the dealer has and if it's good for them (face or ace) you might immediately feel resigned to a likely loss

- You don't need to bet big to win big. You can keep playing $5 minimum with an absolute maximum wager of $15 between Pairs Plus/Ante/Play, and win 30:1/40:1 on trips or a straight flush. Whereas to win big in blackjack you have to be willing to put out a bigger bet. Each game evens out in the long run, but chasing the rush of hitting that big hand can be far more exciting than an absolute maximum 3:2 payout of your wager on a blackjack hand.

It's a poor value play compared to blackjack, though if you've got $200 that you want to put down on a table game and just try your luck, I think it's far easier to have fun with that at a $5 3CP table compared to a $15 blackjack table.

 

Interesting I've never played 3CP and assumed a similar speed to BJ. Not only do you want to lower the house edge but you also want to play at the slower game to limit your exposure to that house edge.

 

Surely, at some point, the other downtown properties will come to their collective senses and go back to $5 on the carny games - especially knowing that the Nugget is rockin' full tables constantly, with their $5 minimums.
As more & more players come to realize this, the other properties will have to either compete, or discontinue the game(s).
...as of a few trips ago, virtually ALL of my UTH, 3-Card & Miss. Stud play is at Golden Nugget.
Paying the price for this?
That would be the El-Co, the D, 4-Queens & Plaza - who all used to get significant carny-game play from me every trip. These days? Almost none.

 

I am generally not a fan of side bets / sucker bets. The exception for me is the diamondz bet on UTH at GN. I have hit 7 diamonds on a $10 bet for $1000 2 times.
Once on July 4th weekend and again just 2 days ago.
Needless to say I'm a sucker for life now.

 

I'm so happy to read a thread about Carny Games! I understand a good portion of persons on here are locals or frequent travelers, but us few times a year vacationers enjoy the thrill and social action with other table compadres in these carny games. It's pure fun during a short trip, maybe hit a big one here or there or not, and enjoy the lights, sounds, views, and time for an hour or two playing some cards and gambling. Side bets and carny games are just that to me, just an added fun and be prepared to lose what you bet. To me though, these are a blast since often you are playing with other table mates and even against the dealer dependent on the game.

I appreciate the intel on the $5 games, it's been spotty to say the least to track down these table minimums during peak hours (Thursday night, Friday early evening and night, Saturday day time and evening, Sunday day and night football/event weekends) on the strip and downtown. Since the las vegas advantage website seems to do lots of weekday morning or early afternoon analysis which isn't very helpful for weekend tourist or those coming in for weekend events. (but I appreciate the intel on that website no matter what it's helpful and awesome. Just wish we'd get some after 8pm intel and analysis).