WWYD - 5/10 NLHE - First hand at the table - 88 and flop a boat

The example I’ve heard is “would you call AK all-in if your opponent has JT”. I heard pros say they’d fold (its about a 60/40 hand right?). I haven’t heard about anyone folding AA. Seems like a tough fold.

 

Similar concept, I'm sure there are a dozen versions of that, but you get my point.

 

That response by V2 is often indicative of massive massive strength. I wouldn't normally fold here, but with his reaction I would strongly consider it and may have done the same thing you did. With that said, the way V1 had been donking off chips throws a wrench in things, obviously.

Since you said the flop was rainbow, V2 has to understand that you may have a huge hand as well once you flat the flop bet of AA8. That he was still willing to shove all of his chips in would get me to fold as well.

Unfortunately for you, they were both pretty awful. A7 should be happy to get to showdown against you after that turn card. Instead, he shoves where the only hand that's calling him is beating him. Just a terrible play on his part. I think you made the right fold without knowing they were both as bad as they are.

I do think you played it incorrectly on the flop, though. I'm either donk betting it or shoving. If anyone has an ace you're almost always getting paid off here and the likelihood that someone is going to catch up on the next two cards after a rainbow flop to get you paid on later streets is pretty small. It also can often rep just having a single 8 or an overpair to the 8, and can induce bluffs/semi-bluffs by other players. Ultimately, you would have lost your chips if you played the flop aggressively, but playing the result is never the correct play. You would have gotten your money in well ahead and got sucked out on. It happens, but it was the way it should have played out.

 

Took some real balls to fold.

You surmised they had NADA.
They did.
Only potential & only a dupe on the 4th Ace or a match could beat you!

I wouldn't have folded.

 

I don't know, it's not all math. These two would give me static. After an hour of play I might have them more figured out, but not quite yet.

 

It being the first hand is not irrelevant. When readless and unable to construct a range, it's typically safer to assume that a player like V2 is incapable of making a play like shoving A7 vs. a person who has a strong range as you did. There's less people out there who play super loose than there are who play tight-passive.

 

Cash is not like a tourney, we don't fold marginal spots because we're totally out of equity if we bust.

This theoretical makes no sense here. If you are folding in spots with a 20% EV edge in cash...sheesh. No pro is folding there. 20% EV is a huge edge. If you get 100 bb in, you're picking up 20 bb of EV - that's a couple of hours of win rate for even a very good poker player at 2/5.

The only reason not to is if you are underrolled, in which case you should be moving down to a game where you can better push your edges.

 

I still think call is the right play, but I get why you didn't.

 

I get this completely... and appreciate your feedback... Just something about it being the first hand and not really having any history/read on V2... I'd be calling someone else out for doing this too.

The roll wasn't the issue, I was ready to reload (more than once if needed), and play below my means when it comes to poker... My spidey-sense was wrong but it worked out in my favor, for sure.

 

My closest card room (excluding a tavern's "Bingo-style" spread limit game), is over 2.5 hours away. I totally get your point about not calling.

 

Yeah this was a 2.5 hour trip for me, same page. I don't make a practice of playing nonprofitable poker when I can help it, but my goal was also to kill the day/night there without spending more time driving than playing.

Side note since I see you're in Washington... I played in Washington (state) a few years ago at Tulalip when I had a business trip to Seattle... was a decent 1/2 NLHE game (loose bad players that night), but a few weird things I observed from playing there...

• There technically wasn't an "all in" bet if you had >$500... the most you were allowed to bet at any point is $500. I think they said it had to do with the Indian reservation laws it was built on, but may not be recalling that correctly. Only affected a few people at the table (myself being one).
• The lighting in the room was dark, it felt like I was in a cosmic bowling / blacklight / roller skating rink environment, don't know how else to describe it. Weird lighting though.
• The chips felt like they were made of rubber... no other way to describe them.

 

seems like a pretty horrible fold, especially against the way you described the others. You should have been high fiving the dealer, but i guess if were being results orientated it was a amazing lay down.... lol

 

I definitely made the wrong decision and then got lucky about doing so... no doubt about it.

 

The maximum bet allowed in Washington is $500. I've witnessed the 5/5 game at Little Creek one day when there were $500 bets that became capped. It runs every Thursday and I do not play that game. Many players have thousands of dollars on the table after a few hours.

WAC 230-15-135
Wagering limits for nonhouse-banked card games.
Card room licensees must not exceed these wagering limits:

(1) Poker -

(a) There must be no more than five betting rounds in any one game; and
(b) There must be no more than four wagers in any betting round, for example, the initial wager plus three raises; and
(c) The maximum amount of a single wager must not exceed forty dollars, except that an all-in wager in the game of Texas Hold'em may not exceed five hundred dollars for house-banked card game licensees meeting the surveillance requirements specified in WAC 230-15-280; and
(d) An all-in wager is when a player wagers with all of their remaining chips on the current hand;

Tulalip is not a favorite of mine (friends like it), but good or bad, I have never noticed the lack of illumination.

 

V2 looking more irritated starts to ask the guy "how the hell did you come up with --" and the dealer interrupts to let him know he can only talk about the hand if the action is heads up. V2 looking as angry as ever goes all in.

Action on hero... WWYD?



I'd definitely call and get rivered! That's my normal MO anyway!

Based on what you said earlier about V1 I can't imagine he's stronger than 8s full and the above statement and angry look from V2 says to me, "I've got trip aces, if you (V1) can beat that, screw you!"

 

so would you of folded if it was the 2nd hand? or 3rd hand you had played?? shouldn't matter. get it in good is all you can do. and you could of gotten it in good on the turn. if its money then you know the stakes are to big. the reason I don't play bigger PLO....I would love to but cant dissconnet from the money at a certain level...... Aces jam 1st hand of the main....300 bb...get it in good no question.

 

Late to the party here, but my thought is that if an overcard on the turn is going to be that scary, you ought to be raising the flop. You’re either getting it all in when you know you have the best hand or you’re taking down a nice pot on the flop.

 

Shove preflop after the raise then reraise ....V1 snaps.....V2 folds

 

don't play a play based on it being the first hand last hand or whatever.that makes no sense and is losing poker.

you say 4 hands beat you but realistically two hands beat you and one he doesn't shove with it (aq)
he might shove a8 but it's so unlikely he has ace 8 with you having 88.
queens is also pretty unlikely but possible.
worrying about quads makes less than no sense in general and especially with him shoving.

folding aa on the first hand of the wsop is absurd, but far less absurd than folding a hand bc it's your first of the day if your goal is to win money.

if you're just playing for fun or whatever that's fine, but you did ask for hand advice. you have to play the hand the best way possible.

 

I understand keeping it on lockdown while trying to get a feel for the table, but if that was your plan, you should not have called pre. Not saying you should not have called, but once you do, then I think you have to be willing to play as normal. Of course this is a bit of a twilight zone hand, and AQ/QQ fits for V2 as does absolute air. His all in is about 3/4 pot vs V1 and slightly over pot vs you so not completely out of line size wise trying to protect his trip aces, especially when as here V1 was trying to get a cheap river. The complicating factor is the out of turn snap call from V1. Even maniacs get hands. Hope I would I have called while mentally preparing to rebuy, but might have been so bewildered I would have folded.
If you find yourself in a game with V1 again, please DM me so I can try to get on a plane to get there.