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The strong-armed catcher whose career was upended when he was bowled over by Pete Rose died

Discussion in 'Non-Vegas Chat' started by archie1959, Oct 13, 2021 at 8:29 PM.

  1. archie1959

    archie1959 VIP Whale

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    Ray Fosse was his name.
    74 years old.
    16 year bout with Cancer.

    Fosse was a budding talent for the Cleveland Indians when he made his first All-Star team as a 23-year-old in 1970, the same year he hit .307 with a career-high 18 homers and won the first of two Gold Gloves while throwing out 55% of attempted base stealers.

    Rose barreled over him to score the winning run in the 12th inning of the exhibition all-star game at Cincinnati's Riverfront Stadium. Fosse fractured and separated his left shoulder, and he told The Associated Press in 2015 his body still ached 45 years later.

    But two days after the all-star game, played against Kansas City, and caught 9 innings but couldn't lift his left arm above his head

    Still see that play and Fosse rolling pain gives you the shivers.
    Played with The Cleveland Indians, the Oakland Athletics, the Seattle Mariners and the Milwaukee Brewers.

    World Series rings in 1973 and '74 with Oakland.

    He had pain and arthritis, endured five knee surgeries, had two bum shoulders he never had fixed, and a stiff neck while playing his position.

    Fosse became a popular broadcaster for the A's beginning in 1986, and he worked through part of the 2021 season.

    RIP
     
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  2. Richard Alpert

    Richard Alpert LOST

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    What a career!
    Battling through pain and then cancer.
    Condolences to his family and friends as he's moved on to the Field of Dreams.

    RICHARD
     
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  3. rooster42000

    rooster42000 Brady, The Goat of all Goats. repeat LVI- #8

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    Remember him well. RIP
     
  4. Michael Smith

    Michael Smith VIP Whale

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    I remember that play as clear as if it just happened. That was when the All-Star game still mattered, if only for pride. I can't blame Rose. That was how he played.

    I think most ex-athletes have dealt with some degree of chronic pain after their careers were over. RIP Mr. Fosse!
     
  5. bardolator

    bardolator Lifelong Low Roller

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    Lifetime Indians fan. Right or wrong, I have hated Pete Rose since that day. We didn't have much in those days, but we had Ray Fosse.
     
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  6. ken2v

    ken2v This Space For Rent

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    He was an exemplar.

    And just another chapter in the sordid story that is Pete Rose's character.
     
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  7. archie1959

    archie1959 VIP Whale

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    Understandable.
    There a photo I looked at this morning of the aftermath.
    There is a SF catcher named Dick Dietz (had to cheat with a search engine)with a smile on his face with Rose while Fosse has his head down.
    He was the closest to the play and had his shin guards on behind the play on the right side.
    Happy that his league won, but I wonder if Dietz spoke at all either before or after is career ended about having any remorse for what happened to Fosse.
    I'm sure he did have remorse afterwards.
    Just a I wonder since Rose and Fosse are the two individuals that are brought up in discussion.
     
  8. WichitaMuskie

    WichitaMuskie VIP Whale

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    Sad to hear of Fosse's passing, but Rose didn't do anything wrong. Fosse was blocking the plate, which was a legitimate strategy in 1970. And the counter to that strategy was to run the guy over blocking the plate. If you don't want to get run over in an "exhibition game", don't block the plate.

     
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  9. ken2v

    ken2v This Space For Rent

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    This will forever be an unprovable hypothesis -- proper or excessive.
     
  10. WichitaMuskie

    WichitaMuskie VIP Whale

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    Sure, but it's a black and white fact that Fosse was standing in Rose's path, stradling the base line two feet in front of the plate. In 1970, a catcher knew what that meant.
     
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  11. ken2v

    ken2v This Space For Rent

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    I imagine they still know what that means.
     
  12. WichitaMuskie

    WichitaMuskie VIP Whale

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    Now it means you're illegally positioned.
     
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  13. vegaskid74

    vegaskid74 High-Roller

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    You're right, you can call Pete Rose a scumbag for a lot of legitimate reasons, but this play isn't one of them. Fosse was blocking the plate, and what Rose did was the appropriate response. What do you propose he should have done - give himself up? Today the rules are different to prevent this sort of thing, but there was nothing dirty about what Rose did on that play.
     
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  14. ken2v

    ken2v This Space For Rent

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    We just have to disagree about Rose's approach and mindset throughout his career.
     
  15. bardolator

    bardolator Lifelong Low Roller

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    The All-Star Game is an exhibition game. Right or wrong, logical or not, that is what made the difference to me.

    It occurred to me many years later that Rose probably had money on that game.
     
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  16. WichitaMuskie

    WichitaMuskie VIP Whale

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    Fosse blocking the plate in an exhibition game is irresponsible, then. Rose could just have easily been injured.
     
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  17. vegaskid74

    vegaskid74 High-Roller

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    I think you're wrong about this.

    But I think you're probably right about this, lol.

    Exactly. How come it was too much for Rose to barrel into Fosse in an exhibition game, but no one questions why Fosse was blocking the plate to begin with in an "exhibition" game? Obviously it mattered enough to Fosse to block the plate, so you can't blame Rose for stepping up to Fosse's challenge. Fosse got the short end of the stick, and them's the breaks.
     
  18. smartone

    smartone VIP Whale

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    Rose and his Charlie Hustle "schtick" in an exhibition game was a dick move that typified Rose's career. That said, Rose should absolutely be in the Baseball Hall of Fame.
     
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  19. vegaskid74

    vegaskid74 High-Roller

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    But the question remains: Why was it a "dick move" for Rose to run into Fosse, but not a "dick move" for Fosse to block the plate in the first place? Fosse could just as easily have stepped aside and let Rose score because it was "just an exhibition game". Why is Rose the only dick for not backing down? Fosse knew exactly what he was asking for when he blocked the plate. If he hadn't sustained the injuries, the play would never have been spoken of again.

    And for the record, I'm not saying Rose wasn't and isn't a dick, all things considered. His former teammates don't even like talking about him. But I don't think the "Charlie Hustle" stuff was schtick. I think he really was just that competitive. Unfortunately he didn't know how to hug the line without crossing it. You don't get 4,256 hits with "schtick".
     
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2021 at 1:06 PM
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  20. BlackJackLife

    BlackJackLife Low-Roller

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    Rose was absolutely making the right play…if the “exhibition” game wasn’t important then Fosse could have just stepped aside and let him score. And Rose’s playing career is deserving of the HOF…
     
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