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Please check my math

Discussion in 'Comps' started by SteveA, Aug 13, 2021.

  1. SteveA

    SteveA Tourist

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    I only had one trip to Vegas last year and stayed at V/P. I earned 23765 points with my stay. My stay was comped except tips, so I didn't earn any points for room or room charges. My total coin in was $73,863.00.

    Based on 4 points per dollar of theo, I had about $5941.25 in theo. $5941.25/$73863 is .0804 which is roughly 8%.

    Did I do the math right?

    I bounced around a little, but I mainly played the Lightning Link machines at $0.10, Top Dollar at $5.00, and another 3 reel machine at $5.00 in the high limit lounge.
     
  2. Brandt

    Brandt Low-Roller

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    Your Theo is not based on points. But on the hold % of the machines. I would be surprised if as low as 8%. Likely in the 10-15% range.
     
  3. SteveA

    SteveA Tourist

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    But according to Grazie, I earn 4 points for every dollar of Theo.
     
  4. Cageet

    Cageet new member of the handpay club

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    How did you get your coin-in? Did you really track it?

    EDIT: nevermind, just saw that you said it was your only trip. So, I assume you got this from your win/loss statement
     
  5. SteveA

    SteveA Tourist

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    I got it from my tax form showing coin in and coin out for the year.
     
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  6. Cageet

    Cageet new member of the handpay club

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    If the 23765 points were tier points the math is correct. And if the 4 points per dollar of theo was applicable for all of last year. I believe the Grazie Rewards program was revamped some time last year. The numbers might have been different. I don't know/recall the specifics.
     
  7. SteveA

    SteveA Tourist

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    It was all under the new program because all of the points were earned during our five day trip at Christmas.
     
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  8. JeJas

    JeJas VIP Whale

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    I think your numbers are reasonable.
     
  9. JulianC

    JulianC Amateur

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    I'll second this sentiment. @SteveA I will certify your theo calculation as correct and congratulate you on beating the house.

    Your daily comp value was somewhere in the range of $350-375. I hope you didn't leave too much comp value on the table.
     
  10. SteveA

    SteveA Tourist

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    I think I did ok. 5 nights, resort fees, all of our meals for 4 adults and 3 kids. We didn’t go crazy in food, and probably charged about $900-$1000 to our room.
     
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  11. JeJas

    JeJas VIP Whale

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    I am more interested in your actual gambling result.
     
  12. SteveA

    SteveA Tourist

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    My actual loss was right at $4200.
     
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  13. JulianC

    JulianC Amateur

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    By my estimate, you left about $50-150 of comp value on the table. You did an excellent job of realizing almost all of your value.
     
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  14. SteveA

    SteveA Tourist

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    Thanks! We may have had a higher food bill than I estimated as well, but I can't be sure since I don't have all the receipts anymore. Either way, I got to do a lot of gambling which was fun, had a couple of hand pays along the way, and got treated well. I usually allow $800-$1000 per day for our vacation budget, so this came out to about that. I will keep closer records on our 2 night trip in September.
     
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  15. Chuck2009x

    Chuck2009x VIP Whale

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    This is very interesting because even prior to the revamp, V/P claimed to be giving slot points based on theo. It was 10 points per $1 of theo at the base level.

    A couple of years ago I tested this on two different 3-reel Double Diamond machines at Palazzo:
    • $1 and $5 denoms on a variable denom machine where $1 was the lowest available
    • $5 denom where $5 was the only denom available
    I did $100 coin-in at each level on each machine and got 125 points each time. Which works out to a 12.5% theo. Which I thought was ridiculous. Ridiculous that either denom would be 12.5%. So much so that I did consider that maybe they had pegged the theo incorrectly (either accidentally or on purpose) in the points system, to "overpay" points. On the other hand, a penny Simpsons game was 14.5% which is pretty much in line with what I'd expect. So I had to take the horrible 12.5% hold at face value.

    8% sounds a lot closer to what I'd expect for a $5 denom reel machine. A little high, but closer.

    The problem is, now I don't know which to believe. Was it 8% then and they were overpaying points? Or is it really 12.5% and now they're underpaying? I'm pretty sure they didn't change the actual hold.
     
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2021
  16. SteveA

    SteveA Tourist

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    I tried your route as well when I was there and got varying amounts among machines. Out of the ones I played in the high limit room, it seemed like I was getting close to 1 point per dollar, so the numbers confused me a bit a too. I didn’t try every machine like that and didn’t check when I changed denominations on multi-denomination machines. I will check that closer next time.
    This is a curiosity exercise for me anyway since I enjoy gambling when I am in Vegas and V/P is our favorite resort.
     
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  17. Chuck2009x

    Chuck2009x VIP Whale

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    I just edited my post because I remembered that on the multi-denom machine I played both $1 and $5 denoms and got the same number of points.

    It would make big difference to me because I love the V/P property but no way I'm paying a 12.5% vig at $5 denom. I haven't stayed there since that experiment but I might have to rethink it since I'm going to half-play Bally's on my next trip, so I'm going to have excess bankroll.

    Trying to decide whether to pocket the excess, give it to MGM when I move to Vdara after Bally's, or maybe give it to V/P in a walk-through.
     
  18. SteveA

    SteveA Tourist

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    I’m with you. We go to SHOT show every year and have stayed at different hotels a few times, but we always come back.

    It is convenient, has a ton of restaurants, and the staff is always friendly. I think they have the nicest rooms too.

    We tried Mirage and Bellagio and neither were as nice to me. Plus we don’t like moving around in the strip. Otherwise, we would consider MLife.

    I guess it comes down to the wife and I like nice accommodations and V/P fits the bill. My luck seems to have been the same anywhere I go on the strip, so I don’t know if there is a huge difference in the holds.
     
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