1. Welcome to VegasMessageBoard
    It appears you are visiting our community as a guest.
    In order to view full-size images, participate in discussions, vote in polls, etc, you will need to Log in or Register.

Park MGM charging a "venue fee" at their bars

Discussion in 'Vegas Nightlife' started by notfromconcentrate, Sep 4, 2019.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. notfromconcentrate

    notfromconcentrate High-rolling diner. Low-rolling gambler.

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2015
    Messages:
    3,140
    Location:
    Toronto, Canada
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    13
    Yes, but a tip is discretionary... and one's discretion is bound to be a little less generous when they've been hit with an arbitrary fee out of nowhere, don't you think?

    Also, if a considerable amount of the tip allocation has been chewed up by this random fee... do you really expect a customer to just dig up more cash out of nowhere? We're not made of money.
     
    • Agree Agree x 5
  2. lmking1224

    lmking1224 High-Roller

    Joined:
    May 26, 2015
    Messages:
    725
    Location:
    North Carolina
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    7
    Yes, I do. Again, the fee is the bar's fault, not the bartender's fault. Your beef is with the bar, not the bartender.
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
    • Love Love x 1
    • Wow! Wow! x 1
  3. notfromconcentrate

    notfromconcentrate High-rolling diner. Low-rolling gambler.

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2015
    Messages:
    3,140
    Location:
    Toronto, Canada
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    13
    You're absolutely correct. But if I'm having a $10 drink and I was only planning on spending $12 with tip... how is it the customer's problem that part or most of the tip allocation got chewed up by a fee that nobody bothered to tell them about? Is every customer supposed to just come up with that money somehow?
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  4. UKFanatic

    UKFanatic The Arbiter of Taste Caviar Kid

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2010
    Messages:
    11,718
    Location:
    Tennessee
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    50
    If you have a budget for that drink that you cannot exceed, then you should ask the price first (or check a menu). There's a difference on "planning" to spend a certain amount and being able to spend more. I'm not defending this practice. It sucks. But I agree with @lmking1224 that you shouldn't screw the worker because the boss is charging an unfair price. Because ultimately, that's what it is, just a steeper price for the same product. If you decide to make a purchase without checking the price first, then that's on the customer.
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Agree Agree x 1
  5. notfromconcentrate

    notfromconcentrate High-rolling diner. Low-rolling gambler.

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2015
    Messages:
    3,140
    Location:
    Toronto, Canada
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    13
    We're all entirely on the same page... I just think that what's not being factored into this discussion is that when this "venue fee" or service charge or whatever you want to call it isn't clearly disclosed, the customer can indeed check the price and still be in for a surprise.

    For clarity... in my case specifically, I ordered from the physical menu and the cocktail was $18. When I got the bill, it was for $21-something. I didn't really pay attention and just paid it with a full tip, which is why I didn't dispute it at the time and only came to realize this when VitalVegas brought it up.

    If the ordering sequence goes Look at menu > See price and agree to it > Receive drink > Get bill with arbitrary service fee added, then what exactly has the customer *not* done to be informed?
     
  6. The Rumor

    The Rumor VIP Whale

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2015
    Messages:
    3,251
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    20
    The real way the bartender is getting screwed is that calling something a "service fee" of any kind sounds like a fee that may be going to staff. Some people, reasonably, might assume it's an included gratuity. I imagine this is doubly true for people who come from countries where receipts specifically discuss service charges, such as France (e.g. Service Compris)
     
    Football Weekend
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Like Like x 1
  7. ronc

    ronc VIP Whale

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2009
    Messages:
    1,542
    Location:
    Houston, TX
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    10
    Lot's of things that are not the actual service provider's fault end up costing them money.

    Yes, everyone should tip the correct amount based on the price of the actual drink (and not the service charge, IMHO)...but will they? Some already don't; moves like this could mean more may follow. Or will they walk, as many here have said they would? The walkers may be the better tippers, so the server gets hurt again.
     
    The Last One Turns 21!
    Will MLife Finally Drive Us Away? Sky Suites 2020 Trip
    • Like Like x 1
  8. vegas30326

    vegas30326 Low-Roller

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2016
    Messages:
    105
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    25
    Wow. Sadly, this doesn't surprise me coming from MGM. They seem to be doing anything and everything to make their resorts less appealing. Tier status at MGM is pretty much worthless these days. Service has taken a sharp nosedive in my experience. What exactly do they offer that I can't get elsewhere? Nothing. Glad I've branched out and am trying other properties/brands. MGM can kick rocks.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Love Love x 1
  9. Sonya

    Sonya Queen of VMB

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 1999
    Messages:
    31,216
    Location:
    Western Washington
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    22
    I think you're all against the fee, but NFC is saying that someone might tip less because they paid the fee and others are saying that person shouldn't. Telling people to tip when they don't want to has always seemed kind of pointless. Do what works for you.

    When the light system started in bars, I asked at a couple of places if it was hurting tips. The people behind the bar at Paris' Gustav's and at Cosmo's Chandelier told me some people didn't tip when they got charged for a drink they thought they should have earned by putting in $20. Is it "right" to withhold that tip? It's not for me to decide, but enough people deciding to do that hurts the bartender. None of them seemed too annoyed about it, so I'm guessing it wasn't the majority of people they served who decided to take it out on the bartender.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  10. nostresshere

    nostresshere Mr. Anti Debit Card

    Joined:
    May 4, 2009
    Messages:
    16,496
    Location:
    TN
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    19
    re: not tipping because of the fee

    I totally agree it is not the bartenders fault.

    I also understand there it is very difficult to get the attention of the back room managers that come up with this stuff. Customers can decide to take their business elsewhere, but the same idiot managers will not admit people are leaving because of the charge.

    But - if the bartenders start raising hell, it has a better change of getting some attention.

    Not right - but I do not know what the answer is.
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
  11. Valgal

    Valgal VIP Whale

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2014
    Messages:
    2,930
    Location:
    Texas
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    17
    They should be made to disclose the convenience fee up front. Either the bartender divulge it or it be posted where you can easily see it. If I saw an 18% fee added on I would think Ohhh they’ve already charged me for a tip.

    I would be asking the bartender where this info is provided and why he didn’t tell me up front. If there is a cocktail waitress involved I’d be asking her the same thing. If you make a purchase at any other town restaurant or store you’d expect to see sales tax. How many would pitch a fit if you wandered to the local Walmart or Target for a few goodies and get charged an 18% extra for using a real checker instead of a self checkout? And not realize it until after you payed?

    They could have just raised the prices. This is extremely deceptive.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Love Love x 1
  12. UKFanatic

    UKFanatic The Arbiter of Taste Caviar Kid

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2010
    Messages:
    11,718
    Location:
    Tennessee
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    50
    I think it is a different situation when the extra fee is hidden (although I would still tip). But the scenario you describe in your last sentence is a straw man argument because in this case, the menu says there is a venue fee. Its disclosed (and I would be more sympathetic to your argument if, in fact, it wasn't disclosed). Admittedly, it doesn't say the amount of that fee, but presumably you can ask before ordering in case that fee is a deal breaker (or you can get up and leave).

    Again, I am not in favor of this policy and have, in the past, left places without ordering upon learning of this kind of junk (FWIW, I have also had at least one venue agree to waive it for me when I complained before ordering). I would encourage people, though, to not punish the hard working front line people because of management's decision.
     
  13. Sprocket

    Sprocket Low-Roller

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2016
    Messages:
    266
    Location:
    Vancouver
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    50
    your right, it isn't fair! Which is why I said this will hurt the bartenders.
     
  14. Valgal

    Valgal VIP Whale

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2014
    Messages:
    2,930
    Location:
    Texas
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    17
    I will usually order a Margarita in a lounge and I don’t need to see a menu. I’m sure many who order don’t look at a menu. I guess It’s on me to ask if there is a convenience fee?
     
  15. notfromconcentrate

    notfromconcentrate High-rolling diner. Low-rolling gambler.

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2015
    Messages:
    3,140
    Location:
    Toronto, Canada
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    13
    I think this sums it up nicely, and personally I can comfortably leave the tipping element of this discussion at that.

    Only thing I'd like to add as a clarification is in response to the bolded text... I never said in what I posted that the menu said there was a venue fee. Admittedly, I wasn't looking for it... so it is possible it was there and I simply missed it. But in the pictures I've reviewed of the Juniper menu, I can't say I saw it anywhere like you would have seen it on the Hexx/Beer Park/Cabo Wabo menu.

    I replied to that chat saying I don't recall consenting to paying that fee, so I'll post back with what their response is to see if it's actually disclosed or not.
     
  16. notfromconcentrate

    notfromconcentrate High-rolling diner. Low-rolling gambler.

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2015
    Messages:
    3,140
    Location:
    Toronto, Canada
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    13
    To be fair, if you sit down and say "I'll have a margarita please", and it's $15 plus a 10% nonsense surcharge, then the price is $16.50 plus tax.

    Whereas if you said "I'll have a margarita please, how much is it?" and they say "It's $15 plus tax" they don't have any grounds for adding the 10% nonsense surcharge because they never told you that.

    It's sad that it's come to this, where you have to actually think about how you ask simple questions like just ordering a cocktail.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  17. h0und10

    h0und10 VIP Whale

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2015
    Messages:
    1,269
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    5
    I tip based on service and experience. Part of my experience is not being charged a "service fee"
    So yes I might screw the bartender who has no control over the rules. Life is not fair.
     
    • Agree Agree x 5
  18. Valgal

    Valgal VIP Whale

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2014
    Messages:
    2,930
    Location:
    Texas
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    17
    Thanks for bringing this topic up.

    It’s not disclosed on their website menu— but it’s not a true menu. It’s not on their Facebook Page either. It just looks like they are trying to sneak it in. The lounge looks beautiful, but a business practice like this is enough to keep me away.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  19. notfromconcentrate

    notfromconcentrate High-rolling diner. Low-rolling gambler.

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2015
    Messages:
    3,140
    Location:
    Toronto, Canada
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    13
    The bartenders also benefit from being union workers... so they actually have leverage when it comes to these workplace policies adversely affecting them and their income. Whereas the consumer has relatively little pushback opportunity by comparison.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  20. 44inarow

    44inarow VIP Whale

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2012
    Messages:
    1,966
    Location:
    Las Vegas, NV
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    35
    This is my take as well. I can't honestly say that I would completely not mind if they raised prices, but at least then they'd be open about it. It's the "$1 drink plus $10 service fee" thing that bugs me.
    That's sort of the point, though. While many people may think about it and still tip responsibly (I do this with Uber drivers now, for example, because of the idiotic 50%-off promotion that's costing the company billions but shouldn't hurt the drivers, so I still tip on the pre-discount fare), but plenty of people won't. It's indeed unfair but if that's the policy the company is implementing, the bartenders are going to get hit.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.