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How to find Theo/ADT

Discussion in 'Comps' started by Bondy3, Feb 1, 2017.

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  1. Bondy3

    Bondy3 High-Roller

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    I see a lot of people here talking about theo and ADT, but how do you find out what your is? I know that putting my card in will tell me tier credits for the day (at CET) and I can log into my TR to see my total credits for the year, but that wont tell me theo or ADT, do you just guess? I thought of this because someone asked about coin-in on another thread I saw and thought this was different enough to ask separately, Thanks
     
  2. joaks

    joaks desert tortoise

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    Ask your host....

    Or if your a slot/vp player, keep track of your tier credits per day, before bonuses.....and do the math. Not 100%....but I'm generally in the ballpark.
    If all you play are penny slots...consider a 15% hold.
    .25 and $1 at 10%.
    $5 at 5%.

    YMMV depending if its Vegas, AC, Biloxi, etc.
    Those holds will put you in a ballpark though.

    Checkout day counts as a gaming day wether you play or not that day! Very important!

    If your a table player, someone else will have to help you on the holds. I never add my table play to my ADT estimate.
     
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2017
  3. grosx2

    grosx2 Have fun storming the castle!

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    Posted by shifter on another board:

    "So I spent some time with my host recently and got actual ratings for various games I've played and calculated the theo numbers.

    of course, they are subject to change all the time, not to mention the computer system itself does weird things sometimes.

    the number listed is the theo generated per 1k bet per hour. so bet 1k per hand for 1 hour and this is how much theo you earn.

    you can multiply these numbers by

    (your bet)/1000

    to get the theo your bet per hour will earn.

    Bacc - $780
    BJ - $521
    Dice - $758
    00 - $1772
    0 - $909
    UTH - $900
    LIR - $1223

    a few takeaways:
    1. the major surprise to me is how screwed you get on the wheel vs Bacc or dice. the HA is way, way higher, but evidently the spins per hour they use is pretty low, so the theo number isn't that high.
    2. the other surprise is how close dice is to Bacc.
    3. this data was calculated over multiple different rating sessions, and they all match up, so it doesn't appear there's as much variance with how the pit boss rates the game (speed of the game, types of bets you were placing, etc.) that we might have thought"
     
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  4. Bondy3

    Bondy3 High-Roller

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    thats super helpful for tables, but how do you get it for machines?
     
  5. grosx2

    grosx2 Have fun storming the castle!

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    Calculate it using basic math. Super easy for VP since you know the exact expected return based on paytable (these can all be found on wizard of odds or vpfree2).

    For example, full pay JOB has an expected return of 0.9954 with perfect play. So your expected loss is 1 - 0.9954 = 0.0046. Say you run $10k thru a machine (which you track by points/tier accumulated)...your theo would be 10,000 × 0.0046 = $46.

    Whether or not a casino expects perfect play or allows for some mistakes when calculating VP theo, can vary between properties, so you would need to consult a host to get a more exact answer for a specific property.

    As far as slots, @joaks already explained that above. Same formula as VP, but it's more of a guess since you don't know the exact expected return like you do with VP. I'm not a slot player but based on what I've read, his breakdown by denomination seems like a reasonable estimate.
     
  6. 7out7

    7out7 Low-Roller

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    I'm going to throw my ADT question in here. I have a 3 night stay coming up at NYNY, so I assume that there is nothing I can do to avoid at least three, probably four gaming days. With that being the case, is there any reason not to make sure every single bet is rated?

    I have often heard that if you're playing smaller than usual, don't bother getting rated because it will hurt your average. That makes sense if you can avoid a gaming day, but once that day has been established, I assume every bet is beneficial to my ADT.
     
  7. joaks

    joaks desert tortoise

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    Before I give you this, understand this is just my best guesstimate. I am generally accurate to within %10 or so. I think this is closer than the tier credits divided by 2 or tier credits divided by 3 that I see on here a lot. The number of nights you stay can be skewed considerably by that basic /2 or /3 method. I've been way off 1 time, though alcohol might have been a contributing factor!

    I did not come up with this. This basic equation has been on this message board for some time. Checkout day didn't use to count, but it does now!

    Tier Credits *$5.00= Coin In
    Coin In * Hold= Total Theo
    Total Theo/#days = ADT

    Lets assume you play a mixture of penny, nickel, quarter, and $1.00 slots on a 3 night trip at any Vegas CET casino......because it's a mixture we can say conservatively a 10% hold average.

    You need to keep track of your tier credits each day before bonuses. Let's say you totaled 3000 tier credits for those 3 nights. Always add 1 day to your number of nights stayed because checkout day counts as a gaming day!

    Sooooooo

    3000*$5.00= $15000 Coin In
    $15000*.10=$1500 Total Theo
    $1500/(3+1)= $375 ADT


    ADT and MDT are similar from what I can tell. MDT is just for areas like Vegas or AC, where there are multiple casinos for CET. They may also count restaurant and shop spending......I dunno for sure.
     
  8. nostresshere

    nostresshere Mr. Anti Debit Card

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    If your card is "tracked" for anything on a given day, you should get all play rated/and/or have card in the machine.

    If you can avoid play for a day, you are generally better to not put just a few dollars on it.

    BUT - Mlife tracks your visit - 2-3-4 days so a zero day in the middle means nothing. I do not know how many days they use for each "trip"
    CET tracks each single day.
     
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