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Comps Newbie Questions

Discussion in 'Comps' started by Eric Petersen, Jan 17, 2022.

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  1. Eric Petersen

    Eric Petersen Tourist

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    I have now been to Vegas about 10 times in the last 6 months. I am remodeling a house there so I travel there from time to time, usually overnight or two nights, to check on everything. I have largely focussed on MGM and have been getting lots of comp offers on many of the hotels. My current offer is 1 night at Bellagio or Aria and $50 room credit. Obviously the other lower hotels are 2,3,4 days comp'd. I am Gold and have a few questions on how to maximize the benefits I receive from the program. I usually play with $1-2k per night and sometimes I win and sometimes I lose. The tier credits seem erradic so I just wanted to figure out what is best.

    1 - How do I get a host, when would I qualify, and why do I want one? Once you have one, do you tip them or take care of them in any way?

    2 - Played 50 and 100 hand video poker at MGM Grand. 25 cents, max bet makes it $1.25 per line or $62.50 per 50 play pull. I put $300 in and played until it was gone. Based on my read, I should receive both 62.5 tier credits and 6.25 points every pull. After playing I had 252 "points" and $2 in express comps. I didn't play for a really long time as it was an experiment. The 252 points seems to indicate that I had coin in of $2.5k and therefore should have received 2,500 tier credits in addition to the points and the comps. Do I have that right? Do I have convert the points to tier credits?

    3 - I read "the person didn't play long enough to matter" on several threads. What seems to be the minimum time for (a) table games and/or (b) slots/VP? I don't mind playing $25 bj or pai gow, just want to be sure that if there is a "magical" time, that I stay long enough to reach it. I also see $25 thrown around as the average bet, is that also an important number? While I understand playing $15 a hand would earn less, if it earns "nothing," and I don't mind playing at $25, then I will play at $25. It doesn't seem like slots/VP would have any time associated with it and it would be just math but wanted to check. I like to play, so might as well maximize.

    4 - I heard the cruise is "not worth it" but have seen people mention trade-in value and that the value changes depending on play. If I was 10k in tier credits away from platinum and the trade in value was $400, then spending $400 on food/beverages/resort fees is a break even proposition. Is this right?

    5 - How much do you tip the cab guy/maid/dealer when you play? Do you tip in game on a big win? Put a bet down for the dealer too? Or just tip at the end? I don't see many people tipping of late.

    6 - I see where people check their play with their host. Do you do this every time? Are the hosts forthcoming with "you need to do X in order to get Y?" I am not a big "talker" and prefer email but again, if it will maximize the benefit then I will make the call.

    7 - Will the Mlife resorts match other services? For instance I am headed there again in a few week and the Mlife site says the room is $1,000 and on Priceline I can get it for $600. If I call the gold line will they match or lower it or .... I assume they would prefer to get the money direct and I prefer that because I get the points for the $ spend.

    8 - My father keeps telling me to take out a line of credit, draw on it, and then give it back later. I told him that everything is based on play and that just taking out a line and not playing with it will not help me. Is that right?

    That is what I have for the group right now. If there are other threads that directly address these I have not seen them. If you have great detail about any one part of the above please feel free to respond to only a portion. I know the rules are changing in Feb, but I think the overall rules will generally stay the same with different points/comps.

    Thanks
     
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  2. 44inarow

    44inarow VIP Whale

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    This varies a ton from person to person, but my standard is $1 for the cab guy, $5 daily for housekeeping, and random $5 bets for the dealer at blackjack and craps. On the first one, you're definitely right that few people tip anymore. On the third one, it can be rare, but I also think a lot of people just don't know that it's a thing. Tipping via bets is the way to go, mostly to demonstrate that you're tipping (a little circular, I know), and I've universally had dealers tell me they prefer to play it, even when I've suggested they just take the drop after three pushes in a row.
     
  3. Raven888

    Raven888 Watanabe wannabe

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    In my experience, $25 a hand will barely get you on the radar at the lower tier Strip casinos, especially with Pai Gow. If you really want to start generating worthwhile comps at table games, you'll probably want to bump that up to at least $50 a hand for several hours a day. $100 a hand for several hours a day will start getting you (basic) comps at the higher end MGM/CET places. That still won't get you a host, though. I'm not sure what level you have to start playing to get that.

    That is my experience over the last several years of going from a $25 a hand player to a $100 a hand player.
     
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  4. nostresshere

    nostresshere Mr. Anti Debit Card

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    VegasMessageBoard is awesome and has answers to just about every question you have asked. Scroll around and check it out.

    I will add that if you make lots of small visits, you will then have a lower ADT and offers will reflect that.

    Tier means nothing for offers. Nothing. Only average play.

    Cruise - not a bad deal if you want to cruise.

    You are well into the low end of getting a host.

    I would also consider a visit to CET and you will get some great teaser offers.
     
  5. Jsmile898

    Jsmile898 Addition By Subtraction and Better Off

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    Unless you are really willing to up your play to get a LOC/host, then I suggest just play as you want and don't get too concerned about how much you play. By thinking too much about comps, people tend to play more than they intended to. Specifically for table games, casinos want at minimum a number hours per day at $100+ /hand. Is it really worth it to chase?

    At the end of the day, just have fun and try to bring home some money. At the end of the trip, just stop at casino marketing and ask what they can do.
     
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  6. 44inarow

    44inarow VIP Whale

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    They prefer to get the money direct, and they only have a best-rate guarantee for the exact same room, so I'd be kind of skeptical of that Priceline rate. Also, if you book through a third party, this entire discussion becomes moot because you're basically not going to get any comps at all, though you might wind up with future offers (albeit not at Aria at the level of play you're talking about).
    This is essentially correct, though from a practical perspective, there's a distinction between a LOC and front-money; there's nothing really to "give back". Putting in a big amount might make you a little more visible to the casino, but not much, and play is really the biggest thing. I had a couple $10k lines open at one point, mostly for convenience, and they didn't impact my offers (or lack thereof!) in the slightest. If you're playing about $1-2k a night and don't mind carrying cash, then I'd just stick with cash.
     
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  7. Jsmile898

    Jsmile898 Addition By Subtraction and Better Off

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    I agree. There's really no point to go through all the hoopla to take out a marker every time you sit down. The people who I've seen take out markers at Aria high limit sign for a marker of at minimum of $20k and up to maybe $100k. Anything over, they do the paper work with the casino host in private.
     
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  8. nostresshere

    nostresshere Mr. Anti Debit Card

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    Another thought that many (me) have overlooked.

    Since you are traveling there lots on your remodel job - maybe find a local casino somewhere closer to your project? Locals do not have the high expense of the strip and offer better deals.
     
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  9. alexm

    alexm VIP Whale

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    1. Hosts at mid tier properties are probably starting with 10k+ per day in slot play, before a host you would probably be getting 3-4 nights plus food and free play offers. At your level you don't need or want one. At the higher level they can add limo transportation an extra night an extra offer etc. If you have a good one, take care of them

    2. Your math seems right, were you not credited correctly?

    3. Generally 25$ and 4 hours are the numbers to get offers. I have heard tale that historically Mlife won't rate under 25, but don't believe that to be true. That may be from back in the days of paper rating. In general 4 hours per day of table play is the magic number, then average bet can make the offers go up or down.

    4. I mean yes mathematically, but I was always under the impression that trade in value was equated to slot play, not hard cash. In which case slot play is historically valued at 50-75% of cash value. And if you play it all and lose it then it has no value. However, if you were going to spend the 400 anyway then it's a no-brainer to do that.

    5. Cab guy has to do more than whistle for the cab (ie open door, put bags in, etc) if he does, usually a five, mostly because I keep dollars for drinks, and tip a lot in fives. Maid is no less than 5 bucks per day, more if they do something extra (I have had maids leave a case of little bottles of water (asked for some extra), lots of extra towels, stock the waters in the fridge, organize the toiletries, etc) in that case tip amount goes up. Dealer is after a decent win (think like 3-4 BJ hands in a row, envy bonus on pai gow, trips or better UTH etc) in that case I usually will put a few whites out as a bet for the dealer. If I am consistently winning I will put a white or 2 on top of my bet for player control but tip the dealer the wins.

    6. This is an it depends scenario. It all depends on what type of room you are talking about and how. Sometimes they match, sometimes no. You should also always book with the resort directly as they can always comp it on the back end if you qualify.

    7. The perk to an artifiically inflated line of credit might be a nicer room offer one time, or might get the attention of a host, but a generic 5 k line of credit if you're already a 1-2k per day gambler won't move the needle. Now if you have enough in your bank accounts to get a 50k line of credit that might open some eyes, but the first time you don't use it they will know that it's not an advantage to offer you more.
     
  10. Eric Petersen

    Eric Petersen Tourist

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    Thank you all for the replies. I can see where my level of play of $1-2k might be a bit misleading. I usually sit down with 1 to 2k and play for a few hours at $25 or $50/hand. At BJ that would mean I am "playing" a lot more than 1-2k in coin-in (to use a slot term). I still think about the amount I play in terms of the money I sit down at the table with whereas you all think about it in terms of the money I put at risk during the hours of play. So if I sit down at a $50 table of BJ for 3 hours, play ~30 hands an hour during that time, would you say I am a $4.5k player? If I play $100/hand then I am much closer to a $10k player. Just want to be sure I am thinking about it right.

    As for tier credits, the platinum perk that is most interesting to me is the taxi line. I have and will go to several Knights games and with Park and NYNY on either side, it would be nice to avoid those really long lines. Not going to "waste" a bunch of money to get that but it is the best perk IMO.

    On 2, I really struggle with isolating play as the credits are jumbled together with my charging dinners to the room, etc. I will take another run at it and isolate to make sure it is my VP play only.

    On tipping, we seem to be on the same page. I make bets for the dealer throughout and I think they appreciate this as it also gets others to tip from time to time. When I play roulette, I think tipping is VERY important as I truly believe that dealers can throw to a particular third of the wheel. They can't hit any particular number but if they consistent throw towards my third of the wheel, we both win. For drinks, $1 and cabs are dependent a bit on whether there are 8 cabs sitting there waiting or whether he is calling for one off the street.

    I am not going to do the line of credit thing. I could get a 20-50k line but it seems a waste of effort since I will never play that much. I can see where whales don't want to carry around $50k so it makes life easier for them.

    I am going to check with the hotels again on the price match for a room. I asked at NYNY once and she said to call the number on the back of the gold card and ask.

    I like to gamble and I like Vegas. I will probably be buying 4 PSLs for the Raiders since they have been my home team in Oakland since I was very small and held season tickets there for many years. With $40 roundtrip flights on Frontier, it probably would cost me more to go to a game in Oakland with parking, etc. I guess we all have to wait until additional announcements are made before we can figure out if other loyalty programs are better than Mlife, but as long as I am in Vegas gambling, I thought I should maximize the perks and comps and this will help. If there are any hidden perks I missed, would appreciate any tips. Thanks everyone.
     
  11. alexm

    alexm VIP Whale

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    10k per day is slot player numbers. Hosted black jack must be much higher. Think about it more in terms of theoretical loss. Your Blackjack play at decent blackjack table (assuming 3-2 at 50$) is worth about 60 bucks in theoretical loss. They want you to play there because you could lose your 1-2k, but the reality is your true value to them is very low. People who primarily play tables, at least from my CET host need to be minimum 100$ average bet x 4 hours/day for multiple trips before a host will really notice. Also at 100 dollars a hand you may be a little over extended on your bankroll (right at 20 units with a 2k buy in) it would take only one bad session to mess up your whole average. A 2,000 loss doesn't move the needle for Mlife in terms of basing comps on a loss so it would likely just go to your theoretical so a quick loss on blackjack can be very damaging to your average value. Unless by the 1-2k you meant your blackjack buy in is between 1-2k and you are prepared to do multiple buy-ins within a given day

    I wouldn't worry so much about accruing tier credits and express comps as far as it dictating what you play. Play what you enjoy at the levels you enjoy and then reap whatever points and tiers it earns you.

    The only game I never tip on is roulette. Have more than a handful of friends who deal or have dealt at our local properties, and it's literally the only game in the casino where the dealer can't influence the outcome or make a player advantageous mistake. On most card games a generous dealer can flash a hole card or even flip cards early by accident, on craps one roll bets can easily be left up or bets can be marked off or on as is beneficial to the player based on the dealer interaction. These things happen so rarely however. Roulette is the easiest game taught to dealers because it's really idiot proof. My close friend who dealt there instead of going to college used to actively try to hit a section of the board consistently (he tried both 1/3 and half because either could be significant). He figured if he got good at it, he could get some of us to go play and make some money and then we would "take care of him later". Either he was not good at it, or he didn't try real hard, because he would spend hours while dealing trying to hit those spots with any level of consistency and he couldn't even hit a half section more than 6 out of every 10 tries.
     
  12. Pika Pea

    Pika Pea Blackjack, Craps, and Squishmallows!

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    This is both sad, and hilarious!
     
  13. alexm

    alexm VIP Whale

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    yeah I agree, he seemed to think the bumpers and the way the dividers lay had more to do with it than his skill set. He got pretty good at being able to get the ball to begin it's descent after 4 to 4 1/2 rotations and could even regularly avoid the initial bumper, but he said what the ball did at the bottom was always a crap shoot. Also because you can't really stare at the wheel waiting for it to hit your "sweet spot" and because the wheel and ball travel opposite directions, he is firmly convinced rigging the game in anyway without a wheel bias is impossible.
     
  14. vegaskid74

    vegaskid74 VIP Whale

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    Yeah, watching the way a roulette ball bounces when it hits the wheel makes me believe dice influencing is probably more doable than roulette influencing. Like you said, identifying a bias is at least theoretically possible, but actual influence seems extremely unlikely.
     
  15. alexm

    alexm VIP Whale

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    @vegaskid74 I completely agree. Dice influencing can be achieved, provided the pit boss or dealers don't force you to hit the back wall on your shots and also if the table is fairly soft. With those to things you could theoretically master a fixed number of rotations based on your throw and ensure that they land in approximately the same position most of the time. However once they land if they bounce hard or hit the bumpers in the back then all bets are off again.
     
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  16. DrScorpio

    DrScorpio Low-Roller

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    If the pit boss and dealers dont care about you hitting the back wall, they probably wont care if you slide the dice either. If you can slide both dice without hitting the back wall, that would definitely be dice influence!
     
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