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Cash Game Clock

Discussion in 'The Poker Room' started by La$Vega$, Mar 19, 2017.

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  1. La$Vega$

    La$Vega$ What happens in Vegas is put on VMB forever

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    The majority of players have been involved in having the clock called on them or vice-versa.
    It's probable that you have been privy to it happening at your table while either in the hand or out.
    (if this has been discussed recently, sorry too lazy to search & maybe there's some recent stories)
    You've seen the big clock firestorms this past WSOP.
    Tournaments are a different animal with the blinds increasing, so let's not discuss those clock issues now.


    My #1 subjective rule is:
    • If I'm not in the hand I stay out of the water
    What's your opinion on the clock during a cash game at the casino?:poker:
     
  2. vegasmacker

    vegasmacker Canadian Ambassador for Sully's Bar

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    Sometimes it is a necessary evil. Every once in awhile there is some clown who thinks he's the next Phil Ivey who will go into the tank for 5 minutes on a double paired board, to a 1/2 pot size bet into a $50 pot and ponder whether his ace high is good. Usually wearing a hoodie, giant headphones and blackout sunglasses lol.
     
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  3. La$Vega$

    La$Vega$ What happens in Vegas is put on VMB forever

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    Sure, I can see all views. If your in the hand I personally feel you can do WTH you want.
    If your not in the hand I think you should stay out of the arena and let the other player(s) involved involved make that clock call.
    But, then again, it's part of your game too...
    jmo
     
  4. spicole

    spicole No shirt, no shoes... NO DICE!

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    I agree with Macker, sometimes it is obvious that a clock needs to be called. I personally have not been at a table when a clock has been called without good reason.

    In general I agree with you on staying out of it if I am not in the hand. I do believe there are exceptions. Some players simply will not make the call or want to speak and it takes a third party at the table to call it.

    Another example: let's say it is a tourney and it is getting close to the bubble (or even after) and a player with a short stack is in the tank. Even though I may not be in the hand I may benefit from any pressure applied to the short stacked player.
     
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  5. La$Vega$

    La$Vega$ What happens in Vegas is put on VMB forever

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    This I can totally see...
    I'm a rec player, so, I was curious what some of the grinders thought regarding being in the hand or not.
    If I'm in the hand and it warrants a clock, I'll call it in a heartbeat after X amount of time etc.
    If not in the hand I feel like it's giving your 2¢ when no one asked for it and refrain.
    Do you know what (if any) rule applies to a cash game in Vegas?
     
  6. bribhoy

    bribhoy Low-Roller

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    Since your question is specifically about a cash game, I'll give my view. First, if the game is being raked on a timed basis, call the clock any time you like. You're paying for the privilege of playing at the table, not watching someone who thinks he's Ivey trying to make a soul read. If it's a pot raked game, there are circumstances where calling the clock is warranted. I'd be more likely to call the clock in Vegas than in my local room, because I'm here for a vacation like probably at least half of the other players round the table. Nothing is likely to break a table faster than persistent tanking. We all have other ways we can waste money in Vegas so if the stalling is affecting the vibe at the table, call the clock. Most of your fellow players will thank you for it - probably silently.

    As far as the rules are concerned, it's fairly standard - including in Vegas - that you can call the clock once the player has had "sufficient" time to make his decision. That can be subjective but 4 minutes is more than enough. Remember that the mathematical calculation in any situation like this is relatively straightforward. Once that is done, it just becomes a struggle between what you should do and what you want to do,
     
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  7. zolar31

    zolar31 Low-Roller

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    Had to call the clock on a guy this weekend. It was a $10 river bet into an $8 pot.
    After about 20 seconds I called the clock.

    It also depends on the following: (it doesn't matter if I'm in the hand or not)
    - is this a player who takes a lot of time for every decision - Yes ( at this point I ask the floor VERY LOUD - can you please transfer me to a table with no hollywooding and with less than 4 regulars? )
    - is this during an every 15 minute high hand promotion - Yes
    - is this a big pot relative to the stake - No
    - is this player a nitty miserable regular - Yes
    - is this a recreational good for the game player - Never
    - small pot - Yes
     
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  8. danny8235

    danny8235 MIA

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    Depends on how many buds I have had
     
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  9. The Rumor

    The Rumor VIP Whale

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    As far as I am concerned they could have a 30 second timer on every action, the way some of these people play in $40 pots is agonizing
     
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  10. NeonTurtle14

    NeonTurtle14 Hot Dogs and Buns

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    I would venture to say in a 1/2 game that 30 seconds is too long :) But agreed in principle.
     
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  11. La$Vega$

    La$Vega$ What happens in Vegas is put on VMB forever

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    Thx for all the info guys, pretty much what I see and thought with added info much appreciated!
    I grind once in a while at our local and have seen a lot of things. I grind online and the auto clock is the best feature added!
    You would think in this day and age the tables would have built in clocks for the dealers to utilize
     
  12. The Rumor

    The Rumor VIP Whale

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    While I would like it, i think it would be a nightmare for dealers. Look at how hard it is to enforce a betting line.
     
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  13. Auggie

    Auggie Dovahkiin

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    If you are one of the fish at the table you can wield a lot of clout with something like "Agh! This guy is taking so long, I think I am going to go find another table to play at..."
     
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  14. La$Vega$

    La$Vega$ What happens in Vegas is put on VMB forever

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    IDK, I think it would make it easier for the table & dealers if there was a built in clock on the layout with a final 10 sec. buzzer or such that they could use. Many times the floor can be busy and not able to get to your table as fast as one would like (jmo)
    Due to online play I think were all conditioned to fast play in under 30-15 sec. these days
    That said, they would still need the floor approve the clock call from what I understand and the dealer can't call the clock on their own, correct?

    When you say 'betting line' are you referring to sequence in seat 1,2,3 betting etc.? as in betting out of turn?
    I have always taken 'betting line' to mean 'what type of 'hand play' as in 'what do you think of the way I played this hand' etc.
     
  15. The Rumor

    The Rumor VIP Whale

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    Some rooms have a line on the table where if chips cross it, a bet has been made. The specifics of what that mean can vary from room to room.
     
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  16. Nevyn

    Nevyn VIP Whale

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    Some big tournaments now have set amounts of time, and give players X 'thinking' tokens they can use for extra time.

    Doing it in a cash game is trickier. A tournament has clock issues due to the blinds (and later due to payoff bubbles). In a cash game, a really long tank is just an annoyance.

    In online poker, the screen calculates things like pot size and opponents' stack size for the players, making pot odds determinations easier. And those not only affect the value of calls, but the effort to figure out the opponents hand. Some people tank way too long or way too often, but they are the exception. And its a cash game, you can leave, or ask for a table change. I don't want to see the angle shots and arguments we'd get from a universal clock in a cash game.
     
  17. lp670lambo

    lp670lambo Low-Roller

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    Somebody can take as long as they want. Cash game is pretty serious. Who am I to rush someone else's finances?
     
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  18. La$Vega$

    La$Vega$ What happens in Vegas is put on VMB forever

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    Note of thx for everyone's feedback/opinions. Online I grind, occasionally BM, playing poker around 45 yrs., NL 20+ or-
     
  19. booker

    booker VIP Whale

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    Fun clock story at 1/3 at The Orleans last month
    Player in seat 5 is a very nice young man who, until this move, was a solid player with good stack, but he pulled this mistake with a few drinks on board.

    • Player in seat 2—a weak player who has tried to bluff hands he should have never been involved in, is the first to act and shoves on the river for about $125.
    • Seat 5 snap calls and quickly tables his cards forgetting that seat 8 is still live. As the cards hit the table seat, 8 yells "All In!"
    • Seat 5 instantly covered his cards with his large hand. (This all took place in about 1 second!) I was sitting next to seat 5 and barely caught that he had top two pair on an unconnected board.
    • Seat 8, another young, semi-crazy Asian player has made some bizarre plays.
    • Seat 5 is not sure that he saw his hand. (After the hand, nobody else said that they saw seat 5's cards.)
    • Seat 5 tanks…and tanks…and tanks… then says, "I'm calling the clock on myself or I'll never make a decision and you folks need to play."
    • The dealer says, "Well, this has never happened before. I guess … I guess that I need to start the clock."
    • Seat 5 mucks about 15 seconds later.
    • Seat 8 racks chips and leaves the table.
     
  20. Nevyn

    Nevyn VIP Whale

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    Lol, what did seat 8 have? Seat 2 was all in so he must have had to reveal ...
     
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