Table Games Basic Blackjack Question

[winner]

Lets keep this simple and short, when there are more high cards than low cards, in the shoe it is an advantage for the player right? Well wouldn't it be the same odds or advantage for the dealer as the player to pull a 20 or 21. I do understand how the low cards help the dealer. Just wondering never heard this explained.

 

[westrocky]

The rule where the dealer has to hit soft 17 and below makes it very risky when the dealer has 12 thru 16 if the deck has more 10s. Whereas the player would stay at 12 thru 16 if the dealer's face card is 2 thru 6 according to basic strat.

 

[winner]

Thank you

 

[Fipe]

There are several reasons but one is that players have certain advantages that the dealer does not, and those advantages become more valuable when the deck is rich in aces and tens. The player gets paid a bonus for a blackjack - the dealer does not. The player can double down in advantageous situations - the dealer cannot. More aces and tens mean more dealer blackjacks, but also more blackjack bonuses and soft double opportunities for the player. If the count is good enough, those advantages are enough to create a player edge.

 

[ColoVegPlayer]

To simplify it even more in addition to what @Fipe said...

Imagine you play a shoe of blackjack where you alternate between the dealer getting a blackjack and the player getting a blackjack.

Do you think you'll come out ahead for the shoe?

 

[jstark]

Lets keep this simple and short, when there are more high cards than low cards, in the shoe it is an advantage for the player right? Well wouldn't it be the same odds or advantage for the dealer as the player to pull a 20 or 21. I do understand how the low cards help the dealer. Just wondering never heard this explained.

6 reasons:

1) Blackjacks. You get (hopefully) paid 3:2, the dealer gets 1:1.

2) Insurance. With a lot of high cards, you can bet on "insurance". The name is misleading. You're just betting there's a 10 underneath the ace and with the right high count, it's a good bet. The dealer cannot bet Insurance.

3) Doubles. You can double on favorable situations like 11 vs 5. The dealer cannot.

4) Splits. You can split pairs like 8,8 vs 6. The dealer must hit and has a better chance to bust.

5) Surrender (when optiional). You can surrender half your bet in bad situations like 16 vs 10. The dealer cannot.

6) Standing. You don't have to hit a stiff hand (12-16). The dealers must, and will bust more ofter in those particular situations in a high count.

 

[holdemhoney]

I should add that just because you have a high count, you might not win. Over all, if you could keep track, you would win more money
with a high count. Just not every high count shoe.

 

[topcard]

I've done a few random tests of 'hi-lo' deck results.
I won't bore you with details, but do these three tests, "flat betting", & you'll be convinced of the impact:
1. Take a single deck & remove all of the 5s & 6s. Cut away the bottom 1/3 of your deck. Deal 'pretend' blackjack hands (from the dealer's perspective). Follow all casino blackjack rules.
2. Do the same thing, except remove all of the Jacks & Queens.
3. Do the same thing, only remove all of the 2s, 3s, 4s, 5s & 6s, but don't cut away any cards, as you've already removed more than 1/3. Take "insurance" or even-money every time the dealer has an ace showing.

Over the course of 3 decks, see how you did.
You should find that you're ahead playing #1 & #3, and that you're down playing #2.

It was enough (plus, just the math of it all) to convince me to vary my bets based on the mix of cards remaining.

I play double-deck games, and keep a separate track of remaining 4s & 5s. This helps when you're dealt a 15 or 16 vs. a dealer 7-10.

 

[westrocky]

I've done a few random tests of 'hi-lo' deck results.
I won't bore you with details, but do these three tests, "flat betting", & you'll be convinced of the impact:
1. Take a single deck & remove all of the 5s & 6s. Cut away the bottom 1/3 of your deck. Deal 'pretend' blackjack hands (from the dealer's perspective). Follow all casino blackjack rules.
2. Do the same thing, except remove all of the Jacks & Queens.
3. Do the same thing, only remove all of the 2s, 3s, 4s, 5s & 6s, but don't cut away any cards, as you've already removed more than 1/3. Take "insurance" or even-money every time the dealer has an ace showing.

Over the course of 3 decks, see how you did.
You should find that you're ahead playing #1 & #3, and that you're down playing #2.

It was enough (plus, just the math of it all) to convince me to vary my bets based on the mix of cards remaining.

I play double-deck games, and keep a separate track of remaining 4s & 5s. This helps when you're dealt a 15 or 16 vs. a dealer 7-10.

Be careful about being perceived as a card counter. You'll be treated quite differently.

 

[topcard]

Be careful about being perceived as a card counter. You'll be treated quite differently.

Between my own stupid mistakes & the periodic deliberate "bad play" I make for camouflage, I don't worry about heat. Besides, my betting range is so small ($10-to-$40) that I probably don't register on most casino "radars".

The last time I caught any heat at all was at the El-Co (over 3 years ago), and the last time I was banned from blackjack was back in the 80s at Circus-Circus (of all places!).
I can't remember the casino (on the strip, sometime in the 90s), but I was once 'flat-betted' - meaning I had to pick a bet size and stick with it.

I think casually noticing cards as they're removed, and slightly increasing or decreasing your bet accordingly, is not the kind of player most properties are worried about.
Now, if you're base bet is $25 and you jump it up to $300? Yeah - that's gonna get their attention. That's just not me, though.

 

[cheaps]

and the last time I was banned from blackjack was back in the 80s at Circus-Circus (of all places!).

Ha ha me too! 3 am at the back room $1 table. I was accused of card counting and I didnt even know what that was, so I learned about it later because of that incident. I'm just a casual observer but its helped me.

 

[topcard]

I was accused of card counting

I lost my cool with a rookie dealer ($5 table, head-to-head). She would re-shuffle on every positive count - even after only one hand!
About the 3rd time she did this, I called her on it (my mistake!).
Pit came over and told me I was no longer welcome to play blackjack at Circus-Circus... I have honored that decision!

 

[holdemhoney]

I have two funny stories about playing blackjack in Deadwood. I was playing and getting just plain lucky cards. The dealer said she was almost done for the day. She was going to hit the tables with my secret strategy. The other story, a group of older ladies showed up at the casino and watched me play blackjack. Finally I told them to sit at the table and I would teach them the game, we all had a lot of fun. The casino gave me a nice food comp.

 

[GamblingGolfer]

My Deadwood Blackjack story … in the mid 90s, sitting at first base. The (octogenarian) dealer couldn’t hide his hole card. Quite the advantage!.

GG

 

[holdemhoney]

I hope you did not mention the fact you could see the hole card.

 

[Rookies11]

My Deadwood Blackjack story … in the mid 90s, sitting at first base. The (octogenarian) dealer couldn’t hide his hole card. Quite the advantage!.

GG

Mine was at O’Sheas, the training grounds for BJ Dealers. Paid us up and down… more than once. One of my buddies was going to say something. We kicked him under the table!

O’Sheas got the hook out after 20 minutes and sent her to the showers!