Video Poker What to play for no hand pays this year?

I typically play $5 VP always hoping to hit the big one but this year I would like to avoid hand pays and the tax impact that goes with them. I've seen on trip reports comments about multi-line play to avoid them. Such as 32 or 38 lines (I can't remember which) on a 50 or 100 play machine to get a sum less than < $1200.

So, my question to all you good folks is what would you suggest I switch to? 3,5,10 play? Different denom? Different game?

Thanks

 

Its difficult to advise you to play a different game when we don't know what game you are currently playing - unless you mean something like -play baseball rather than VP . JOB,DW,TDB will all have different best denoms/number of hands to play to avoid most handpays

 

Play quarter machines.

 

Single line quarter with no progressive. Trying to make myself switch to these because of taxes also.

 

If you like 5$ denom especially for comps I would look for $5 Jacks or Better where SF pays 239 coins. This means your only W2G would be for a 20k royal. If you need the thrill of potentially big hands then .25 poker in any game makes sense and if you keep it to 1 line you are guaranteed no handpays. I guess you just have to decide what level of handpay is "worth it". I play quarters or dollars because a 4k handpay is "worth the hassle"

If I recall correctly you like $5 bonus or double double and that's where you run into issues. Every quad on double double is a W2

 

If you used to play $5 denom, I am not sure you would like to play $0.25 single line.

 

If you play JOB at quarters and limit your hands to 38, you can avoid W-2Gs for all except dealt straight flushes or more than one royal on one hand.

 

For the 75-80% of Americans that no longer itemize with the new standard deductions, paying that 10% or more in income tax turns VP into a less than desirable option. And if they have another 5% state tax, it really turns the game into something closer to slots.

 

in general, the lower vol games generate fewer W-2. So avoid stuff like TDB and DDB if you want to play dollars, avoid stuff like DSTP that can multiply those games from a 400 hand into a 2000 dollar hand, etc. Progressives also stand out.

FAB has given you some good advice on playing multihand quarters. I also note that, at dollars, if you find games where the max pay besides the royal is 1,000 (like some deuces wild games), you won't trigger that many W-2s unless you play multiline.

 

Just play whatever I've been playing for the last 22 trips to Vegas because I never get a Royal or handpay

 

I appreciate the comments. I agree some tax forms are worth the effort and might seek a middle ground. It will be hard to step away from DDB and TDB but that is probably the best. There is nothing like an attendant walking up with two bundles of hundreds to pay a RF or AWAK on TDB but the quad tax forms are a problem. I already have two of those this year.

This will be my first full year of retirement so the tax bite won't be near what it has been in the past. Even still, I used 2019 tax software to estimate my 2020 tax for the purpose of managing IRA draw downs to a certain tax bracket and realized that repeating my gambling wins and corresponding losses from 2019 still has a considerable bite. I'll probably be itemizing due to medical expenses above 10% AGI since AGI will be a much lower number but we will see how it goes.

Next trip is 02202020. I would loved to have been there for 0202 2020 but couldn't swing it with the NYE losses. Anyway, I'll be working to maximize play for comps while minimizing tax forms.

 

Not sure if this was directed at my comment about 4k being an "acceptable" W2G or his 20k being an acceptable W2G. My understanding is on any W2G you can also ask that taxes be held out, but I have not done that. For me a 4k royal ends up costing me around 500 ish in taxes, however we do have enough so that I can itemize if I have a W2G. We have right around 23k in deductions every year so it's not that difficult to itemize another 1500 or so to get around that. I do keep detailed notes on my gambling play and also certainly don't play every day so it's not hard to track. I also save lottery tickets from myself, my wife and friends which helps.

 

FYI - and YOU may already know this, but having some of the win with held does not change the tax bit at all. The tax bite for the year is EXACTLY the same either way.

 

WARNING - w2g forms have a direct impact on AGI. And that AGI impacts "ACA" along with possible medical deduction as mentioned above. For tax novices, AGI is the total income BEFORE you itemize.

Above note added for the benefit of "others" as I know lots of folks really believe the witholding is specifcally to cover taxes on the win and do not realize all income and w/h just falls into the same pot.

 

For sure, I just meant that if you have it witheld up front, you may not have to come up with as large an amount when you file. Or if you end up with enough to itemize you make end up with a better return.

 

As does any non-W2G generating win...

I know, I know...I will leave this thread now.

 

Hey thanks again I really do appreciate all the comments. I got the tax part figured out as I always get way too many gambling tax forms. I also keep detailed gambling logs which I hope will support an audit if that ever happens. Even if you itemize and claim as much losses as wins, you get hit on some of the other AGI limited items.

I'm thinking $5 JOB or multiline where I only get a tax form if i hit something great like a RF or a dealt multiline premium makes sense. Avoid the DDB and TDB where I get a $1250 tax form for a quad. Also, I want to try the 38? hands on multi line to see how that goes.

 

Yeah this has totally adjusted my play when it comes to .25 progressive machines. Then that 1300 royal is less of a play for me.

 

You may get more W2s than you expect. When playing 38 hands getting more than one Royal when dealt 4 to a Royal isn’t that uncommon.

You’ll be dealt 4 to a Royal on average once every 2765 deals.
If I did the math right, with 38 hands
- 44% of the time you’ll strike out and get 0 royals.
- 36% of the time you’ll get exactly one
- and so 20% of the time you’ll get 2 or more.

That works out to a W2 roughly every 14,000 hands.
That’s almost 3 times as often as single line $5 JOB, but the total w2 amounts will be much less!

 

Yes, if playing 38 hands, you will get Royals more often than playing 1 hand - since you are playing 38 times faster/more often.

But, if playing 38 hands, I would guess it might be a lower denomination per hand, and therefore a lower payout. Surely not playing 38 at $5 a hand - for most folks.