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Venetian/Palazzo Comp Question

Discussion in 'Comps' started by USCdude87, Sep 9, 2015.

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  1. USCdude87

    USCdude87 Tourist

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    Hey guys, long time luker here. I just wanted to share a story, and see what your thoughts are.

    I recently stayed at Aria for 4 comped nights, and also had a comped 3 night stay at Palazzo. On the last night of my stay at Palazzo, I stopped by the Credit Desk to ask if I can get a comp. The original representative I spoke with was a woman who was pulling up my account. While doing so, a guy jumped at me and offered $500 in F/B for my party of 4, and said he would happy to comp more if needed. In addition, he provided Limo transport to the airport for my friends and I.

    I do not have much history at V/P, as I mainly play at Aria/MLife. I normally play slots with a little bit of BJ. My play at Palazzo was not much IMO, as I was wiped out at Aria. I earned 40K Grazie points, and made Gold after my 3 night stay.

    I know that Status Points are made up from theo, which is confusing to me. Can you help give me an estimate as to how much 40K points equals to coin-in on average? I normally play penny slots. Also, is this a normal type of comp for this play? Apparently this guy who is super cool is my new host. I was very happy with his offer, and look forward to staying at V/P more often.

    Thanks in advance!
     
  2. VegasChic-

    VegasChic- VIP Whale

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    I think if anyone could answer the coin-in portion it may be chuck2009x - If you are willing to wait, your coin in as a total for the year shows up on your win/loss, but I haven't otherwise been able to get a number.

    I've stayed at V/P 4 times since December, and I still struggle to figure out how marketing/comps/hosts come up with numbers. I find that they are only willing to give average bet and hours played, and my host will give my THEO, but have heard many others can't get the number. Even with the THEO, I haven't been able to get the host to say what % they consider for the discretionary comps. When I approached her, she will just say, yes, you still have room, you should go for a nice dinner! Can't get her to say HOW nice a dinner, and of course that value can range wildly in Vegas.

    My first couple trips I had a lower THEO- maybe around 3000ish. From that, marketing was sending 3 nights, $600 FP and $150 F/B, and they were still taking all the dining charges off the backend. I had a third trip where the THEO was 6000- and my basic marketing offer changed only to increase the freeplay by an extra $100. I've now had a fourth trip where my THEO was 6600. I'm very curious to see if the basic offer changes at all. The host was great in that they did take off all the charges, provided limo and show tix- but i wonder still how much room I may have had left over, if any?

    I've heard that V/P marketing may use a "banding" system....ie- you may fall under a band that lumps players with Theo of 3000-8000 in the same category and you won't see much difference between those players in offers until you hit the next banding. Great if you are at the 3000 level, not so great if you are at the high end of the band. If this latest play doesn't increase my offers more than the $100 in FP since going from 3000-6600, then I will guess it is the case?

    Regardless, I've really enjoyed all my time at Palazzo, and will continue to see it as my home property despite the fact I have no clue how things really work there, lol. The host I've been dealing with has taken care of all excess charges so really my net cost is zero- not much to complain about!! They do hold their numbers/calculations etc close to their chest, but in the end they seem to ensure it's fair off the backend.

    Hope this helps~
     
  3. Chuck2009x

    Chuck2009x VIP Whale

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    When you say "On the last night of my stay at Palazzo, I stopped by the Credit Desk to ask if I can get a comp." I can't tell if you are talking about having charges taken off you bill for that stay, or future consideration.

    Grazie awards Status Points at 10 points per $1 of theo for the first 20,000 Status Points, then 15 points per $1 of theo until you reach Platinum. You also get 5 Status Points for each $1 of hotel spend.

    So if you were looking to have charges taken off the back end, we'd have to know how much actually got taken off, how much your final hotel bill was, and at what point in all of that your stated benchmark of 40,000 points occurred.

    But if you earned 40,000 points just from gambling, that would work out to:
    $2,000 in theo for the first 20,000 Status Points
    $1,333 in theo for the next 20,000 Status Points

    For a total of $3,333 in theo, or $1,111 per night, which should generate about $333 a night in comps, from which has to be deducted the cost of the room.

    The only time I ever did a measured session at Palazzo to see if I could calculate the hold on a machine vs coin-in and Status Points earned, it was a nickel machine and the hold came out to 12.5%. If we use that number, then $3,333 in theo implies $26,664 coin-in over the 3 nights.

    In any case, $333 in comps per night could be broken down to $167 per night in F/B ($500 total) and $160-ish (or somewhat less) for one room.

    It does seem somewhat out of character for someone at Palazzo to be jumping out throwing that $500 at you however.

    On the other hand, with that amount of coin-in on pennies, I'd expect your actual loss to be somewhere between $4,000 and $5,300 if you didn't hit any large payouts.

    Any of that match up with your trip?
     
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2015
  4. Chuck2009x

    Chuck2009x VIP Whale

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    I think that's true of all the chains. You can see it in the codes associated with your offers. I think they've changed the coding schemes at V/P and MGM, but it used to be easy especially at MGM, to tell what comp band you were in (and there were a lot of them), at least in terms of the code itself, although not the specific dollar ranges.
     
  5. AbeFrohman

    AbeFrohman Tourist

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    How do they calculate theo for table games? I play blackjack and craps. I don't play their 6/5 blackjack on the floor (which really isn't blackjack). I play 400-800 total spread on one or two hands. I mostly play pass and come bets with full adds on craps. I have had up to 1200-1500 in play at a time. I still can't figure out how they rate either of these.
     
  6. FordDlr

    FordDlr Low-Roller

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    Chuck could you calculate that for someone that puts up about 300,00 tier credits at an Mlife property. Almost all of it slot play. 5 and 10 dollar denoms.
    Just curious if I'm taking advantage of all I can. Usually its a 3 night trip.
     
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2015
    New Years and UFC207
  7. NickyJ

    NickyJ Tourist

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    Chuck is correct. In the past V/P used a tier system for offers, 0 to 9. For example, an offer coded at a 0 might have been several nights in a suite, with a large amount of freeplay and F/B credit, while a level 9 offer might have been 2-3 nights in a standard suite and $25 freeplay. When the Grazie system was revamped a few years ago, I believe V/P switched to a letter tier system for offers, A to Z, with A being the best, but I don't know how it breaks down in comparison to the old number system.

    VegasChic, I agree that V/P does not like to overshare! The whole 'theoretical win' concept is confusing. You're also always guessing a bit when you judge whether you're maxing out your comps. For instance, what value do they use for the suite? On a comp, I'm not sure, but I don't believe the casino 'charges' you more for a bella or view suite over a standard suite like they would if you were booking it retail. But, the floor and view you get in part depends on your level of play. I've heard Hunter mention that he doesn't count initial freeplay against comps. Is V/P the same? I'm assuming the full value of slot rewards counts against comps. I believe Evoni mentioned once that the Platinum limo benefit does not count against comps. But, does it count against comps if a host offers it when you're not Platinum, and what's the value? If you learn any additional details, be sure to share!

    In regards to the OP, Chuck offers great info. It's hard to judge your backend comp without knowing other variables, ie the comp offer you came in on, how many Grazie points you had to start, how much you spent F/B total, the play of the rest of your party, your actual loss...
     
  8. USCdude87

    USCdude87 Tourist

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    Thanks for all the great info! To share more details, I rarely played at V/P beforehand and took a couple years hiatus from them. I only had 1K points from earlier this year when I stopped in for 1 hr. I booked a marketing comp for 3 nights in Bella suite, and $100 FP. In regards to going to the casino desk, I didn't charge anything to the room, and just asked for a upfront comp for dinner. That's when the host on duty offered what he did. So I basically racked up 39,000 points all on slots in 3 days of that helps
     
  9. mephisto2000

    mephisto2000 Low-Roller

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    At $5 or 10 you are probably not playing on specialty slots that require $10 coin in for 10 tc. Regular slots require $3 coin in for 10 tc. So 300k tc / 10 * 3 = $90,000 coin in.

    Not sure what the hold at $5-10 denomination is. Assuming 8% gets us $7200 theo and Mlife comp rate of 35% equals $2520 in comps.
     
  10. Chuck2009x

    Chuck2009x VIP Whale

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    Yeah that's the right calc for coin in, and I'd also use around an 8% hold on a $5 machine (it might be a little less).

    I think 35% as a comp rate might be a little on the high side, but I don't really know.

    Depending on which MGM property you stay at, for a 3 night trip that should be getting you some pretty substantial offers - a suite, some daily F&B number around $300, and upwards of $500+ in freeplay.
     
  11. Chuck2009x

    Chuck2009x VIP Whale

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    Then just in terms of theo, what you got sounds about in line.

    Him offering you $500 I guess could work out to $125/person for a nice dinner. Do you recall what your actual win/loss was? Anything $3,500 or below, you did pretty well results-wise. Something closer to $5,000 would be more typical. The reason I ask is that if your actual loss is much higher than your theo, a host might be more inclined to extend you more in comps than your straight theo would warrant.
     
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2015
  12. NickyJ

    NickyJ Tourist

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    If my math is correct, you should have earned about $240 in slot reward dollars. I assume the host didn't turn that into resort credit towards your dinner. There are always variables, like if you won big and the host wants to encourage you to come back and play that money at V/P. I don't know if the rest of your party played on your card, didn't gamble, or played separately, but that could influence things too. The $500 comp sounds reasonable to me given your play and the offer you came in on.
     
  13. FordDlr

    FordDlr Low-Roller

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    Thanks for the info. I'm going next Wednesday have a suite and limo transfers and 900 in free play. My host always takes care of room charges as well. Last trip out I had UFC tickets as well.

    Sounds like I'm being treated fairly looking at the calculations you've come up with.

    Thanks so much for taking the time to look at the numbers.
     
    New Years and UFC207
  14. USCdude87

    USCdude87 Tourist

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    In terms of gaming, I only lost about 1.5K. Friends didn't gamble on my card either. In terms of slot credits, I earned about $200-$220, which I think is way more generous than MLife. I'm actually really happy the way I was treated at V/P compared to how I normally get treated at Aria, even though I keep getting offers from them. It's a good feeling to have another place I can call "home"
     
  15. NickyJ

    NickyJ Tourist

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    Sounds like a good stay at V/P. Just curious, where did you go for your comped dinner? Did you like it? Glad you found a second home!
     
  16. USCdude87

    USCdude87 Tourist

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    Went to Carnevino...food was good. Been there before, so I figured it was a safe choice.
     
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