1. Welcome to VegasMessageBoard
    It appears you are visiting our community as a guest.
    In order to view full-size images, participate in discussions, vote in polls, etc, you will need to Log in or Register.

Vegas Burnout vs. Longevity

Discussion in 'Misc. Vegas Chat' started by BeeeJay, Apr 7, 2013.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. BeeeJay

    BeeeJay President of The Red Lobster Hostess Satisfaction

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2008
    Messages:
    7,725
    Location:
    Chicago & Jersey City
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    85
    The recent announcement of pending May trips and accompanying reports from "The Bucket" and "Jaco" brought the subject of Vegas Burnout to the forefront of my mind.

    I suppose at the end of a bad trip we all experience that feeling flying out that we don't really need to return any time soon. Hell its a veritable staple of my trip reports, as predictable as my plan to play quarters pre-trip, is my vow to never return post-trip. Of course 6 weeks later I've invariably got another trip booked.

    According to what I've read Jaco has been on a 2 1/2 year hiatus, and The Bucket on a 2-year dry spell. Hurricane Mikey took a long break. Whale Jo has apparantly "retired". Some of our regular contributors like VegasBJ and JillyfromPhilly have taken long breaks.

    What do we all supposed is driving some of the best players away from Vegas? Is it a bad trip? A big loss? Bad service? A retired host? General deterioration of gaming and comp conditions? Maybe its just life situations for people in general, work, hurricanes, divorces, etc.

    But it does seem to be a more regular occurrence, and I admit I've been on the edge myself, cutting back to a degree that sort of represents a fractional burn out.

    What does the board think?
     
  2. shifter

    shifter Degenerate Gambler

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2010
    Messages:
    10,096
    Location:
    At the tables
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    30
    there's definitely lots of reasons for taking a break from Vegas. after a bad trip or especially a few bad trips in a row, it can leave you with a bad taste. that can be gone in a few days or it can last several months. it depends on how bad the trips were. or sometimes life changes and you have different priorities and that moves you in a different direction. but the true degenerates all get the itch back eventually.

    but when thinking about certain people who haven't been around here in a while, I wouldn't confuse taking a break from VMB with taking a break from Vegas. there's lots of reasons to take a break from VMB that have nothing to do with Vegas.
     
  3. Chuck2009x

    Chuck2009x VIP Whale

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2009
    Messages:
    4,075
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    16
    Obviously not the only reason, but...Money. Even if you stick to a budget, there can be a feeling in the back of your mind somewhere that the expense is not justified.

    Every once in a while it occurs to you that your head would stop hurting if you just stopped hitting yourself in the head with that hammer.

    Then that feeling passes, and you look at the hammer sitting on the table and say "that hammer isn't going to hit me in the head all by itself, now, is it?"
     
  4. booker

    booker High-Roller

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2009
    Messages:
    903
    Location:
    Washington State Coast
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    70
    1. General deterioration of gaming and comp conditions
    2. Poor traveling companions
    3. Crap I take from friends/family … "You're going AGAIN!?!?"
    4. Conditions of gambling budget after a losing trip
    5. The Vegas of today has a different vibe than the Vegas of my past
     
  5. Gaggles

    Gaggles VIP Whale

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2009
    Messages:
    1,496
    Location:
    Calgary Area
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    100
    I have scaled back last year from 2011 but 2011 was quite excessive. Between Laughlin and Vegas I had 10 trips. Last year between Laughlin, NOLA, and Vegas I had 8 trips. This year I'm likely gonna get in 6. My thoughts and reasoning on burnout/less trips:


    - I'm playing higher denoms. Tough to get excited about $62.50 quads on DDBP when playing .25. But playing higher means bigger swings which can be uncomfy at times.
    - Comps tightening, although the last recession may have unfairly conditioned me to being overcomped with free weekends at Caesars, Mirage, and Bellagio.
    - Every f+cking time I turn around they are downgrading the f+cking vp so that we have become happy if we see 5/8 at a bar top!
    - I am on a large three trip losing skid that is preventing me from the very large trip in a few weeks with Beejay, Mack etc.

    But I could never envision a time where I could be away from Vegas longer than 3-4 months even in the most egregious of losing scenarios! Those of you leaving for a year+ must be on a terrible run!

    On the plus side:

    - It's not the company. From Vegasbj, Natedogg, Jinx, and many more, I am meeting fun people. This does not even include the hard core usual cavalcade of low rent degenerate associates who are with me on a regular basis.
    - Minus gambling...cheapest holiday on the continent.
    - The weather...enough said....
    - The staff etc. we have come to know at our usual haunts are awesome.
    - I have no serious customer service problems in any capacity. I accept at times the cocktail waitresses are busy or have to big of a section to get me drinks as fast as I would like. I have no customer service horror stories.

    So, to all the suits and tall foreheads running Vegas....I am coming less and you are getting less of my money which is a direct correlation to the increasing hold and the reduced pay tables. I suppose if you are making up for guys like me with your food and beverage hold you couldn't care less. But due to your actions the states of California and Florida as well as the country of Mexico and the Bahamas shall be enjoying my vacation money rather than you this year and for the foreseeable future.
     
  6. smartone

    smartone VIP Whale

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2011
    Messages:
    5,264
    Location:
    Northern Nevada
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    204
    I absolutely agree with you on this! You can get lucky on anything, but the pay-tables have been tightened to shit!
     
  7. leo21

    leo21 VIP Whale

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2010
    Messages:
    4,713
    Location:
    Chicago South Suburbs
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    14
    Why a hiatus? Just life. It was probably 10 years between my second and third trip. I wasn't making a lot of money and I f-ed up the little bit I had. I really didn't go anywhere for a long time. Now I am slowing down on trip and will get to the point where I stop going. I realize that the money I spend on a couple Vegas trips would be better spent going and doing new things. When I think of the things I want to see in my lifetime, I won't experience most of it going back to Vegas all the time.
     
  8. LV_Bound

    LV_Bound VIP Whale

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2010
    Messages:
    4,907
    Location:
    Florida
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    18
    There could be numerous reasons. For us we would already have another trip planned but the last trip kicked our asses financially. Also, some people may work for a company like me where the company is doing tremendously well but feel they no longer need to give raises to their employees.
     
  9. archie1959

    archie1959 Low-Roller

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2007
    Messages:
    353
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    0
    For me it is reason number 5 that Booker stated.
    Being unemployed since July 2012 does not help.
    If I do not visit in 2013 no big deal.
    But I would miss a certain location called Red Rooster.:wink2:
    Gambling will always be there.
    What I have noticed is that 24 hour vibe to city is missing for me.
    Must be due to that I am 53 years old.
     
  10. mike_m235

    mike_m235 Tourist

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2012
    Messages:
    2,421
    Location:
    Colorado Springs
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    12
    I always burn out. Sometimes for a week, this recent time for 3 months after I got back. I just had no desire to go back. For me, 2 trips a year is perfect. I'm always ready to go back by the time the next trip rolls around.
     
  11. BeeeJay

    BeeeJay President of The Red Lobster Hostess Satisfaction

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2008
    Messages:
    7,725
    Location:
    Chicago & Jersey City
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    85
    for me, even with a great winning overall 2012 campaign, and pretty much the dream December trip, I had this feeling of a gouge and being played for a sucker.

    95% of that was when I sobered up and saw the paytables on my quad hits. Couldn't complain about Cosmo deal, service, or comps at all. With the exception of some really slow service and highway robbery prices at a couple restaurants.

    But damn if I wasn't hitting quads out my ass I could see it being a blood bath. And its not as much fun winning when 90% of your crew is getting pounded on the 7/5 bartops.

    despite my short term positive results, I knew I had the worst of it in a big way and felt like being played for a sucker. I hate that.

    This trip I'll go in a lot more cautious after reading all the losing trs and bad odds here.
     
  12. mike_m235

    mike_m235 Tourist

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2012
    Messages:
    2,421
    Location:
    Colorado Springs
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    12
    For me, playing DDB, I find that there's not a huge difference between 9/6 and 9/5. Yeah, I know it's one percent. But at DDB you're either hitting quads or you are not hitting quads. If you're hitting, you're winning. If you're not hitting there is no amount of flushes that's going to keep you from going busto.
     
  13. BeeeJay

    BeeeJay President of The Red Lobster Hostess Satisfaction

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2008
    Messages:
    7,725
    Location:
    Chicago & Jersey City
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    85
    none of us have any complaints about 9/5. Like gaggles said, these days at a good bar we will play 8/5. Its when 7/5 pops in and you are getting down to 4% house advantage, probably roulette odds when we are drunk but with 600+ decisions per hour, the risk of ruin vs reward relationship becomes irrepably skewed.

    Don't get me wrong, well still play but slower and at lower denoms.

    I'm willing to pay a given price per hour of entertainment and the specific games and odds the casino offers will dictate how I slice and dice the play. I can promise you there will be no pics of $2 quads on 7/5 machines this trip.

    One thing the DDBers in my crew tend to overlook is that Bdlx payable of 8/5 is close to DDB of 8/6 so they aren't directly comparable. Plus the variance on Bdlx is halfway between JOB and DDB. A less exciting game to be sure, but if you buy into it like I do, its a smoother ride. (and less W2s for the $2 player)
     
  14. BeeeJay

    BeeeJay President of The Red Lobster Hostess Satisfaction

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2008
    Messages:
    7,725
    Location:
    Chicago & Jersey City
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    85
    none of us have any complaints about 9/5. Like gaggles said, these days at a good bar we will play 8/5. Its when 7/5 pops in and you are getting down to 4% house advantage, probably roulette odds when we are drunk but with 600+ decisions per hour, the risk of ruin vs reward relationship becomes irrepably skewed.

    Don't get me wrong, well still play but slower and at lower denoms.

    I'm willing to pay a given price per hour of entertainment and the specific games and odds the casino offers will dictate how I slice and dice the play. I can promise you there will be no pics of $2 quads on 7/5 machines this trip.

    One thing the DDBers in my crew tend to overlook is that Bdlx payable of 8/5 is close to DDB of 8/6 so they aren't directly comparable. Plus the variance on Bdlx is halfway between JOB and DDB. A less exciting game to be sure, but if you buy into it like I do, its a smoother ride. (and less W2s for the $2 player)

    Also I might reference the $8000 royal pic and the quad 3s with kicker pics un my pre-tr. Both were on "last hands". So that extra $5 CAN make a huge difference.
     
  15. buzz_king

    buzz_king Tourist

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2012
    Messages:
    90
    Location:
    Iowa
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    49
    My Vegas highpoint was 2005-2007 when I went 4-5 times per year. Now it's 2 maybe 3. The difference is that it use to be 2 hours to the nearest casino and now I have one within 40 minutes and one just over an hour. I am now hitting the locals once or twice a month and Vegas less.
     
  16. C0usineddie

    C0usineddie VIP Whale

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2011
    Messages:
    2,516
    Location:
    San Diego
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    12
    I cant speak for most people but it does seem that peoples expectations get in the way sometimes of enjoying their trip.

    The think they should have gotten more comps or they somehow deserve more then what they got.

    They feel that somehow vegas has turned on them because they are loyal players and are not getting rewarded the way they think they should be.

    I get no comps because i dont expect any and dont play at a level that would warrent them.

    I go a couple times per year and have a great time every time. i get exhausted by trips end and look forward to getting home but thats just because of the abuse my liver took while there.

    i also only take no more then $900 with my for 5 days. I always return with at least $400 so I spend about $100 per day for food, drinks, gas, and gambling.

    If i was plunking down $100 per meal I would have high expectations. thats where it all goes south, expectations.
     
  17. Viva Las Vegas

    Viva Las Vegas Ramblin' Gamblin' Man

    Joined:
    May 31, 2008
    Messages:
    2,594
    Location:
    Chicago
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    46
    1/3 Lower Comps, 1/3 Higher Prices / No More Free Flights & 1/3 Burnout

    I averaged about a trip a year (17 trips 1991-2008) until 2009.

    2009: 6 Trips
    2010: 5 Trips
    2011: 6 Trips
    2012: 6 Trips

    2013: 1 Trip

    The major reasons for the increases in trips are I was getting great room comps (Bellagio, Aria, Cosmo, several others), free flight vouchers (traveled more for work and volunteered 3 or 4 times to be bumped for free flights), had a few more free flights (1 way or RT) via miles. I was able to take advantage of the slowdown in Vegas and the economy.

    The other major reason is my brother moved to Vegas a few years ago. I also planned side trips during my Vegas trips, as I am not interested in gambling 24/7, especially during my longer 10-14 day trips.

    In 2013, I'm taking one 13 day trip in August/September, using 12.5K miles and paying $162 for the flights, and I'm looking for comp offers heading into the trip. Plan on staying downtown, in Summerlin, off strip and/or on strip (likely 3 or 4 hotels total).

    The 5 star hotel comps are gone (thanks MILFe, for the memories). I plan on continuing the discipline since 2010 for playing only FP machines and sticking with BJ or live poker to have the best chance at a profitable / break-even trip.

    Also, as my working income & age increases, my risk tolerance decreases. I am putting in financial goals to try retire within the next 12-15 years, God willing. I like to play and have a good time, and have learned to stick within better limits and playing the games with the best possible outcomes (staying with Green Chip BJ, or FP VP). Drinking and relaxing has surpassed chasing big wins / clawing back from big losses as my goal in Vegas. I suspect many others have changed their desires due to family changes and other non Vegas considerations.

    I stopped gambling locally since the late 1990s. Vegas is my only destination for gambling and I'd like to continue to go out 1-2 times a year as long (perhaps for extended trips of 1 month + in retirement) as long as I am able. I believe the days of 5-6 flights/trips per year are ovah, but I enjoyed it while it lasted.
     
  18. BeeeJay

    BeeeJay President of The Red Lobster Hostess Satisfaction

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2008
    Messages:
    7,725
    Location:
    Chicago & Jersey City
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    85
    yeah this is really close to my current situation/feeling/intention
     
  19. IWannaBeInVegas

    IWannaBeInVegas VIP Whale

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2002
    Messages:
    2,639
    Location:
    Between here and there
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    20
    For me it is life. I'm a single parent, I can't just drop my son off at his mother's since she lives in Texas and with my father passing last year, I don't have anyone to watch my son. My only option is during the 5 weeks he is with his mom, but I'm more of a March in Vegas than a July in Vegas guy, but at this point July maybe it.
     
    Tentative Arrival
  20. mike_m235

    mike_m235 Tourist

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2012
    Messages:
    2,421
    Location:
    Colorado Springs
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    12
    I saw 7/5 on my last trip, but it was one of those machines where it changed the payout depending on the denomination. It was 8/5 for quarters and 6/5 (!!!) if you wanted to play nickels. It was 9/5 for dollars and 9/6 for $5.

    I think 8/5 is kind of bartop standard. Even at hooters, where they have awesome VP throughout the place, it's 8/5 at the bars. BTW, if you just looking for straight paytable and nothing else, go to Hooters. VPFree doesn't do them justice. There's a lot of full pay in there.

    I may have to look into BDlx...thanks for the tip.
     
Tags:
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.