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Table Games UTH - I'm new at this ... quick question

Discussion in 'Table Games' started by The Furry One, Apr 12, 2014.

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  1. The Furry One

    The Furry One Low-Roller

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    Never played UTH, not even sure it was out when we last visited in 2011? Had a little play on Wizardofodds just now though and don't think their 'WIN' box is quite right? For instance (and I know this is a raising hand I just checked it all the way to the call to get a feel for the payouts) ...

    Betting $5 across the board:-
    Me: QT (Q37-93) no flush
    House: 95 (Q37-93) no flush
    WIN box says I won $10 but I think I only won $5? Play and Ante both win @ 1:1, Blind pushes and Trips loses - so $20 out there and $25 returned - can someone just check that I'm getting the payouts correct before I let them know as I don't want to look a complete wally if I'm wrong lol?

    Furry
     
  2. NickyDim

    NickyDim VIP Whale

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    Sure you didn't bet 2X after the flop of high pair (QQ)?
     
  3. topcard

    topcard Older than the Stardust!

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    You should have bet the 2x on any pair with one of your hole-cards after the flop.
    If you have the "tell me if I make a mistake" feature on at the wizard's site, it would have asked you if you're sure (not betting the 2x).
    If you clicked "ok", you would have checked.
    If that's what you did, you won $10 ($5+$5), pushed the blind and lost the trips bet (-$5)
    Your net would have been +$5.
    But I believe the game subtracts all of your bets when you make them.
    So, you you would already be -$15 at the deal, and another -$5 after calling the river.
    You would have $15 returned to you (ante, play & blind) and $5 taken from you (trips). So - yeah - +$10 at the end of the hand.
    :beer:
     
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  4. sindustry

    sindustry VIP Whale

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    The simulator does not take into account you lost $5 on the optional trips bet. The simulator only factored in the required bets. In your case, since the dealer qualified with a pair and your hand was higher, you won $5 on the Ante and $5 on the Play. Your Blind pushed, since you did not have a straight or better. You lost the $5 trips bet since you did not make trips or better. Overall, you did only win $5 based on all wagers, but the simulator only took into account the required bets...not sure why.


    EDIT: Topcard and I must have replied at the same time...his explanation is much better! In a real game, you will 4x with that Q10.
     
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2014
  5. tringlomane

    tringlomane STP Addicted Beer Snob

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    I like your tone of voice. You WILL 4X with that QT. :thumbsup:

    I'm guessing OP had warnings off or didn't follow them. :poke:
     
  6. The Furry One

    The Furry One Low-Roller

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    Dead sure, deliberately checked it all the way to the call.

    Furry
     
  7. The Furry One

    The Furry One Low-Roller

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    Thanks for the response. Yeah, I know what I should have done were I playing for real money, deliberately ignored proper strategy and the "are you sure" message as from an earlier hand I was convinced the WIN box had told me a different amount to what I actually won and wanted to check it in the least mathematically challenging way possible lol.

    Not sure I'm quite getting your explanation ... clearly showed I had $20 out on the felt in bets which we agree on ($15 + $5) but the game returned more than $15 from the ante, play and blind (that would just be the initial bets without the extra $5 payoffs for both the ante & play I believe).

    Maybe it's just me but I regard any win or loss amount as the total of all chips coming back to me (if any) minus the total of all chips put out at risk and presumed the WIN box would calculate in the same fashion.

    Furry
     
  8. The Furry One

    The Furry One Low-Roller

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    Thanks for the reply, I think you may be right in your assessment ... no idea why the Trips bet would be ignored ... will have to play a winning hand where that bet wins now and see if it is still regarded as irrelevant to that calculation lol.

    I love Wizardofodds - probably the most useful online gambling aid out there imo which is why this baffled me so much.

    Furry
     
  9. The Furry One

    The Furry One Low-Roller

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    Spot on but no need for the poke as I ignored them deliberately for this hand ;)

    Furry
     
  10. The Furry One

    The Furry One Low-Roller

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    Lmao - even more confused now ... just played a hand where the trips bet won:

    Me: 85 (2K2-25)
    House: Q6 (2K2-25)

    Again checked to the call with $5 across the board, WIN box says $65 which means it has included the Trips bet. $20 risked, returns of $10 for the Ante, $10 for the Play, $20 for the Blind (3:1 for the FH) and $45 for the Trips (8:1 for the FH).

    Furry
     
  11. topcard

    topcard Older than the Stardust!

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    OK...I just went back and played your way - checking through the flop and calling on the river.
    The "win" box does show only what you've won. But your chip total does not change by that amount - it changes based on what chips come back to you after a win.
    So, the blind bet, (unless you have a straight or better), will always come back to you after a win, or even after a loss to a non-qualifying dealer hand.

    It paid wins properly for me on every hand I won.
     
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  12. The Furry One

    The Furry One Low-Roller

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    Thanks topcard, wasn't doubting the integrity of the chip balance just the WIN box itself and as you say it only seems to show what you've won in terms of what the dealer has actually pulled out of their tray and paid out on top of your bets. Still seems a strange way to have it set up to me but I guess it's working entirely as intended so I shall not make a fool of myself by saying anything to the good folks at the Wizard. Thanks to both you and others for double checking for me, appreciated.

    Seems a fun game btw.

    Furry
     
  13. sindustry

    sindustry VIP Whale

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    The "Win Box" definitely seems to be only counting the chips won and ignoring the original bets that are returned or lost. Add up only the winning chips from your full house example and it will total $65. Likewise, add up only the winning chips from your first example and you will get $10. Your actual win will be different from what the simulator displays.

    Another great site to visit is discountgambling.net. He and the wizard collaborate often on gaming math and analysis.


    EDIT: lol...I am late to the party again.
     
  14. The Furry One

    The Furry One Low-Roller

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    Late or early sindustry all responses are appreciated by myself :)

    Thanks for the link to that other site, wasn't aware of that one before.

    Furry
     
  15. WrongWayWade

    WrongWayWade VIP Whale

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    Yes, http://discountgambling.net/ultimate-texas-holdem/ is THE place to learn about this game, IMO. He has a play-against game as well, and I know what you were saying about how it was a bit confusing seeing what I was winning vs. what I wagered, etc. But the total between hands was going up or down the correct amount. The way he handled the amount of the next bet and what's left in my stack wasn't clear to me, at first.

    And 4X on QT is correct, of course.
     
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