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Table Games Take me down, please.

Discussion in 'Table Games' started by Electroguy563, Nov 30, 2013.

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  1. Electroguy563

    Electroguy563 Over-Fried Gambler

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    :thumbsup:A co-worker of mine and myself discovered that we mutually love to play craps. I prefer the right side while he enjoys playing the dark side.

    He gifted me with a book titled "Advanced Craps by John Patrick". It covered his famous "Patrick System" but also covered a wide range of right side betting systems and theories.

    One of the techniques he recommends is to not leave your place bets up too long. His emphasis argues that you ask the dealer to "take me down" after one or two hits. He feels a guaranteed profit per shooter, no matter how small is better than pressing too long and having the 7 sweep all your place bets away along with whatever profits it would have generated.

    Seems like a good idea, however, how many of you out there do this? I'll bet a good number of us are intimidated of asking the dealer to "take me down" for the feeling that we are bothering the dealer. And some of us will argue the potential loss of profits if the shooter happens to go on a heater.

    I usually don't take my place bets down. I will "same bet" twice then press. But usually by then the pressed bet goes down to the inevitable 7. But I do this because I feel you'll never know when the shooter will go on a monster roll and I want to have my bets out there when it comes. Unfortunately the bets get swept away more often than a monster roll. So now I'm entertaining the idea of incorporating the "take me down" theory and settling for the smaller wins potential.

    My question: If you are the type of player that never takes his place bets down, is it because you are hoping for a heater or are you reluctant to bother the dealer to "take me down, please..." I must admit there were times I wished I came down but didn't want to bother the dealer.

    Next trip I want to try this theory and if quite successful will toke a little more often to offset bothering the dealer for the "take me down, please..." :beer:
     
    Going to Hawaii's 9th Island!!
    Going to Hawaii's 9th island!!
  2. bubbakitty

    bubbakitty native Texan; born and bred.

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    I too am conflicted. If I place 30$ on the 6&8 and hit twice I need to start removing or reducing to 18$ each. But generally stay for the big score which does come but for the 20x I don't take it down the bottom line is not good. It makes sense as if I took it down I pocket 60$ but if it hits twice again and the I lose to the 7 I make a grand total of 10$ more....not sure what takes over rational thought when actually in the frenzy of the game. Take it down-take me off-color me up.....it is one of their daily tasks and you should not be shy about working with your money.....good question though.
     
    1st Super Bowl DT...Panthers / Browns no doubt
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  3. sfchris

    sfchris Low-Roller

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    I always play the Come rather than buying numbers so I cannot take it down!
     
  4. TuneinTokyo

    TuneinTokyo High-Roller

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    I too am torn. I leave mine on in search of the hot roll. I usually only place six and 8 and keep them there. I will up them once or twice if things are going well, but I generally never take them down.
     
  5. mdk63

    mdk63 Tourist

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    Your last concern should be "bothering the dealers". They'll learn your pattern and may even remind you if they're any good. Play the way you want, not the way the dealers want you to.
     
  6. R8erhed

    R8erhed Tourist

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    I find it hard to fathom your concern with the dealers feelings. They are there to do as I tell them and could care less what they think. Are they concerned about your sad face when they scoop all your chips up on 7 out?

    I usually press a # when it hits, if it hits again, I pull it. An even easier approach is you don't have to 'take it down' each time, just tell them your place bets are 'off' they put an off-chip on it and you can put them on/off as you see fit.
     
  7. jhaley83

    jhaley83 Tourist

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    Its your money, take it when you feel like it

    Advanced Craps by Patrick is by far my favorite book on the subject, and I have read or checked out almost all of them. I am typically a darkside player, but when i do play right i always take down place bets after a predetermined number of hits, while using a regression strategy.

    I could see how you might be shy about asking the dealer to take down a bet at a crowded table, but so long as you are a tipper, and are courteous about working your bets, there should not be any problem. If you catch flack from the dealers over this, consider moving tables or finding another place to play. I find that it is hard to win if I don't feel a good rapport with the table crew, so I will move around until I feel like my action is appreciated.

    Remember, that is your money until you pick it up or lose it to a seven out. If you dropped a twenty as you walked through a casino, would you feel bad about picking it up? Tip your dealers, be friendly and considerate, and work your bets as you see fit. That's how I see it.

    Best of luck at the tables!
     
  8. crapsaddict

    crapsaddict Tourist

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    If I am planning on placing numbers as a general rule when I play, I never take them down after a couple hits. I feel there is a better chance of a shooter continuing to hit a number than it is for each shooter around the table to hit your number a couple of times. Generally speaking the people I have seen trying to guess how many times someone is going to hit a number never seems to work as well as just leaving it run out. If I lose confidence in the shooter, I may reduce the units I have on a number down a bit but thats it.
     
  9. jrinct1

    jrinct1 VIP Whale

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    There are NO "systems" that work consistently on the dice table ( or gambling in general). That said when I play I DO use the regression system a lot...unless there is something-- a pattern-- I can clearly see or have that "feeling":rolleyes2::rolleyes2::rolleyes2::rolleyes2:. And of course it has MIXED results.
     
  10. BeeeJay

    BeeeJay President of The Red Lobster Hostess Satisfaction

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    I'll employ this occasionally and remember getting flack a few times from an Australian dbag dealer at Cosmo. So I quit tipping that table. Easy solution
    :beer:
     
  11. thecarve

    thecarve Misanthrope

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    Uh...yeah. Unless you're a dick or never tip, of course they feel bad when you lose a lot.

    Can't say it any better. :thumbsup:
     
    Number 50!
  12. Electroguy563

    Electroguy563 Over-Fried Gambler

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    One time a dealer kept berating me about not putting full odds behind my passline and would remind me everytime the passline number hit, which wasn't very often. Hindsight is always 20/20. He was being a genuine jerk and would snicker everytime this happened.

    Time to leave. I looked him straight in the eye as I handed the STICKMAN my toke, saying "for the dealers". I know they pool their tips, I just wasn't gonna hand it to him, and I wanted him to know that...:beer:
     
    Going to Hawaii's 9th Island!!
    Going to Hawaii's 9th island!!
  13. crapsguy5000

    crapsguy5000 Low-Roller

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    When I place Bet

    I mainly play the dark side as it seems to me that I can make my bankroll last longer by playing the Dont's as compared to playing the Passline or Place bets. I used to use a regression strategy when I place bet but discovered that for me, it makes more sense to leave it up since we can not accuratly know what the dice will do.
    What I do is place the six and eight for $6.00 each, and if one hits will place the five. I then take a one roll additional risk on the field using the profit from the field to place the nine. If the field does not hit but rather the six, eight, or five hits I will wait for another six, eight, or five to hit before placing the nine. I then take a profit before covering the four and ten on the next two hits. After I have all numbers covered I press every other win. Once my four or ten place bet hits $20.00 I buy it. I then keep pressing every other win until the shooter sevens out.
    What I like about this way of playing is that I only risk $12.00 on any one shooter so it does give me some staying power at the table until a decent roll comes up.
     
  14. arrgy

    arrgy Tourist

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    Every sixth roll is supposed to be a seven.

    Imagine this scenario..

    Come Out roll A..

    2,3,11,2,11,3,8

    Come Out roll B...

    8

    In which scenario do the trend odds suggest you will most like hit some numbers after the 8? Always be disciplined always come down after a certain number of rolls, never chase the hot shooter.
     
  15. Keyser Soze

    Keyser Soze Low-Roller

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    Oh my!

    Please do not listen to ANYTHING John Patrick says. Unless you hate money!

    He is a clueless voodoo author.

    Go to wizardofodds.com and study the math behind your game of choice.
     
  16. Gaggles

    Gaggles VIP Whale

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    I think the flack you took from the dealer had more to do with him hearing about you throwing up in the elevator the previous day......
     
  17. vegasvic

    vegasvic VIP Whale

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    There is certainly some value to using a regression "system". I generally place the inside numbers and then press it one unit every other time that number hits. Of course I always end up losing my largest bets. Mathematically you should bet the minimum and just flat bet but find that boring no matter how "smart" it might be. I might try placing $10 or $12 on the inside numbers and then regressing to $5-$6 after a number is hit, thereby "locking in" a profit on that number. Then pressing on subsequent hits.

    That's one of the fun things about craps, there are so many different ways to play. Obviously we are all bucking the house edge but there is nothing better than a hot craps table :)

    Is John Patrick still around?
     
  18. wrxrob

    wrxrob High-Roller

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    At a $5 table, sometimes I'll do $44 inside, then regress to $22 inside after the first hit (makes for about $5-7 risk I think).

    Other times I've been known to bet the iron cross, leave it up too long, and end up with a net loss after a few field hits :grrr:

    One area I almost ALWAYS regress is the hardways. If I hit a hard six for $1, rather than take the $9, I usually say "10 and down!". I know it's only a buck, but I've seen many others press/parlay the rare hardways and lose it just as fast as they won.
     
  19. WrongWayWade

    WrongWayWade VIP Whale

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    There is no such thing as 'trend odds'. Each roll is independent of all the rolls that came before, so examining history tells you nothing about the next roll or how likely it is that a 7 is coming.

    The chance of a 7 is 1/6, every roll, each and every time, over and over and over again.
     
  20. Ben Jammin

    Ben Jammin VIP Whale

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    Luck Favors the Prepared Mind

    It's good to be lucky, but it's even better if you know what you are doing. Dice are no different. We learn how to take advantage of the "Lucky Streak" or "Trend " as JP likes to put it.

    The main idea is to use your skill and cunning to the best advantage possible for you.

    The best advice is to minimize your losses, which in turn maximizes your chances of winning.

    Place bets, line bets, don't bets, come bets, don't come bets, proposition bets. Play them as you will but having a good working knowledge of the game before you play is advisable.

    When I want your opinion, I'll beat it out of you, on the table of course.

    Just learn to pocket some of those winnings before you play out.
     
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