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Suggestions for Casino Management

Discussion in 'Non-Vegas Chat' started by MikeOPensacola, Oct 30, 2012.

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  1. MikeOPensacola

    MikeOPensacola VIP Whale

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    These are my suggestions for casino management to get more people to visit, and STAY at their properties. Ranked in no particular order except the first:

    1. Read Vegas Message Board every day and find out what is said, the good and the bad, about you AND your competition.

    2. Seriously, get rid of 6/5 BJ. The first casino to do this will see dramatic increases in BJ revenue, and thus other gaming revenue. This was one of the worst marketing decisions in LV in decades.

    3. Resort fees are a rip off and are a deal breaker for many people who visit LV.

    4. Don't try to be all things to all people. Find your niche and stick with it.

    5. Promote early check in, without fees.

    These are the most important suggestions I can think of. If just one or two of these were implemented I believe your revenues, and profits, would increase.
     
    Annual Summer Bliss in the Land of Milk and Honey!!!
  2. Someone

    Someone High-Roller

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    I can agree with all of those

    as to the last one the check in I have said it on here before I think they need a flex check in and check out

    in a place that prides themselves on 24X7 having firm check in and check out times (and the rush that comes with it) does not make sense

    with people flying in they can save a ton of cash on late night and red eye flights why not accommodate them and even have a travel package for them with a very late check in and a very late check out and maybe even some type of meal deal late night on the first night and the last night

    I think it would make better use of the front desk and the cleaning staff as well instead of having a big rush window of people checking in and checking out and rooms needing cleaned

    my other advice I have said before and that seems to be happening at some companies is take back control of the vast majority if not 100% of your property instead of farming it out to third party operators for clubs restaurants and the like
     
  3. shifter

    shifter Degenerate Gambler

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    who says those ideas would make revenues and profits increase? most people i talk to have no clue the difference between 3/2 and 6/5 BJ. that's why all the 6/5 tables are full. sure going back to 3/2 would make a few knowledgable people come back, but as a whole i think their profits would decrease. as far as resort fees, again, i think that's a deal breaker only to a select few, not most people that go to Vegas. i think a lot of people that know about them don't care and most people don't really think about it. so again, i think they increase the hotels' profits. as far as early check-in, i can see accommodating people when they can without fees, but if they promoted it that would put a huge weight on the housekeeping staff that would be unmanagable on busy weekends. imagine if 50% of people showed up at 10am, they would have no way of having all their rooms ready and that would just piss people off. at least now people know their room won't be ready until 3pm so if it's ready at 10am, they're stoked.
     
  4. Nevyn

    Nevyn VIP Whale

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    This comment reflects a dramatic misunderstanding of the gaming market in Vegas. If you doubt me, you should go to the typical CET party pit at 10pm and see how PACKED the 6:5 tables are.

    Casino management aren't stupid. Most gamblers are FAR more casual than the people on this board. They gamble where its convenient, they play the games the "wrong" way. And they don't know the difference between a good and bad game.

    In fact, running all 3:2 would attract the most skilled players. But you don't necessarily want them if you can get the drunk tourists in those seats.

    Furthermore, blackjack tables have overhead. You have to pay a dealer for his time. You have to pay the pit boss to monitor a few tables. You pay the eye in the sky. And you need to take up enough floor space for the tables, the players, and an aisle in behind (space that could be used on a slot machine).

    Why does that matter? Because it means a packed $5 3:2 blackjack table filled with basic strategy playing min betters really won't make you that much money. If you are low overhead and need an attraction to pull people in (ie: Downtown, Off-Strip), it makes sense. But for a strip casino you either want to be running higher limits with good rules, or lower limits with higher HA.

    They are just a different way of charging for the room. Just as with airline fees, they are only a ripoff if you didn't know about them when booking. Otherwise, compare total cost, and you're fine.

    If you got mLife to drop their resort fees, it wouldn't make all their hotels that much cheaper, they would just raise their rates to compensate. And charge you for coffee and the fitness room separately the way CET does.

    They don't like early check-in for practical purposes. Even though most people could check out without seeing the front desk, tons of people in the morning use the desk to check out. Having people check in early makes the lines longer.

    What's more, the rooms are often not ready early unless they were vacant the night before.

    Don't get me wrong, I don't like the fees. And if I go to a registration desk early when there is NO line, and am willing to wait for my room to be ready and just want to get my key sorted, I think hotels should waive the fee.



    Your suggestions are a good list of the things that annoy people, or the things we would like to see changed. But that is not the same as being good business policy for the hotels. A lot more people would buy iPads if they cost $50, but that doesn't mean Apple is pricing them wrong.
     
  5. stackinchips

    stackinchips High-Roller

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    ^^^ This ^^^

    This board seems to be full of people who have never run a business before.

    1. While reading this board may give you insight to what is being said about your company, for the most part, there isn't much to be gleaned from reading an anonymous message board made up of a microcosm of your clientele, where complaints are going to be grossly exaggerated most of the time anyways. You'd need to hire full time employees just to follow a couple of boards. Not that this couldn't be somewhat useful, (Mlife website anyone?) but most of what could be gathered from this board, they already know from direct comments from their clientele.

    2. 6/5 BJ exists because they make more money off it than 3/2. Most people don't know the difference, especially the low end player. That's really why 6/5 isn't at the higher limits, because those gamblers wouldn't play it, plus a table with 1 green chip player is as profitable to the casino as a full $5 table. If the casinos did get rid of 6/5 they'd probably get rid of all $5 BJ tables as well. You want low limits? You play 6/5. There's a cost to having that real estate taken up by a table and paying the dealer to deal cards. $5 table at 3/2 with free drinks, probably doesn't make the casino squat.

    3. This one I can agree with from the standpoint that it's bad PR. People don't like to feel nickeled and dimed. Much like SW not charging for luggage, (just bump the price up $25 to reflect the bag fee anyways and nobody knows the difference) it's great publicity to say that you don't have any extra fees, even if at the end of the day, the price is the same anyways.

    4. I would agree with this, however, I think most individual properties do this pretty well. Bellagio isn't catering to low rollers, but Luxor/Excal do. Caesars has high end dining/shopping and nice rooms with price tags to match. Harrah's has Toby Keiths and a fake jewelry shop.


    5. As shifter said, early check promoted would be a logistical nightmare. As it stands, you can usually get early check in for free unless they're busy. It states that you can't check in until 3PM when you make the reservation, so you can't complain if your room isn't ready before then. If you do get an early check in, you're stoked. If they advertised it, they'd have everyone and their brother trying to check in at 10AM and they'd be pissed when housekeeping couldn't turnover rooms then.


    It sounds like most of your ideas are written from the customer's position, without giving any thought to the economic impact it has to the business. While it's great to give your customers excellent service, you have a wish list that for the most part isn't economically or operationally feasible.
     
  6. mike_m235

    mike_m235 Tourist

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    You're mistaken in your belief that what's best for players is best for casinos. As a rule, you want to attract the worst gamblers possible, not the best.
     
  7. MTMONGO

    MTMONGO Low-Roller

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    I don't get early check in. I am there for the gambling and booze, my room can wait.
     
  8. HoyaHeel

    HoyaHeel Grammar Police & Admin

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    When I arrive, I've been flying for hours and up for even longer. I want to get into MY room and get my things situated, rest in my OWN bathroom, wash up, refresh....and THEN I'm ready for Vegas.

    Sure, if the room isn't ready, I can leave my bags with the bell desk and use one of the hundreds of public bathrooms and no one will notice that I'm rumpled because it's Vegas and thousands of people look worse (and better) than I do. I could start gambling or eating or sightseeing immediately.

    Just because I can do those things doesn't mean it's my preferred start to a trip:peace: Different strokes, etc.:peace:
     
  9. blackjacknut

    blackjacknut VIP Whale

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    I agree 100%, this is how Las Vegas was built and this is how Las Vegas will continue to operate. It is those who don't realize these things that keep Las Vegas moving and in business. And those of us who keep returning regardless. This doesn't mean you have to play the "bad" games just educate yourself.

    The list that the OP posted to me are annoyances, some of which I can avoid and some that are not in my control...don't worry be happy.....it is VEGAS!
     
  10. captainron62

    captainron62 VIP Whale

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    I think sometimes we get tunnel vision, we are a microcosm. We are far from the average LV traveller, we belong to a travel message forum dedicated to one destination. We travel typically more than twice a year to said destination. LV prefers the hit and runners that done question anything, dont know 6/5 from a hole in the earth and spend, lose and like it. Then come back none the wiser and do it again.
     
  11. zamboni

    zamboni VIP Whale

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    I am still convinced resort fees are a sneaky way for properties to "hide" revenues from the Gov't
     
  12. MikeOPensacola

    MikeOPensacola VIP Whale

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    True about most gamblers being ignorant. No doubt about that. But what is easy to forget is how many discerning gamblers that we don't see at the party pits on a friday night at 10:00. Our money is just as green as those mornons who play 6/5. While we are playing elsewhere they are missing out on revenues of serious players with decent bankrolls. Benny Binion built an empire on the theory of giving a patron a good gamble and a good time. His place thrived until he died and then his family and eventually corporations took control and it lost a ton of business and prestige along the way. I guess my point about all this is that the corporations sure know how to squeeze blood out of a nickle, but somewhere along the way they forgot about quality customer service and treating the average patron like they are really valued.
     
    Annual Summer Bliss in the Land of Milk and Honey!!!
  13. leo21

    leo21 VIP Whale

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    This is the one I agree wholeheartedly with. Too many casinos are trying to go young. They aren't willing to make the complete investment to do it, though, and you end up with something that doesn't work for anyone. If you want "kids", go all out with the burger bars, clubs, bad table rules with pole dancers and rooms with all the technological tricks you can think of. But the casinos need to remember that they all can't get the kids and there is money to be made focusing on other market segments.
     
  14. topcard

    topcard Older than the Stardust!

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    I simply ~shrug~ at the 6:5 tables & those who play them... I just won't join them... I'm sure plenty of good BJ players might equally wonder why I routinely play 3-card poker - a game with an even greater house edge than 6:5 BJ! Well, I play it because it's a fun diversion from the "sometimes-grind" blackjack can be.

    As for 'early check-in' - I've rarely had any problem with this. I always go to the desk when I arrive, regardless of when that is. I think I get my room early (before 3) about 75% of the time... Back in the old Stardust days, they had an "Invited Guests" line at check-in that was much shorter... just one of the perks of being a rated player. (I still miss the old girl...)

    I supppose my list of suggestions would be sort-of different:
    1. Return to providing cigarettes to any table-game player with a player's card.
    2. Do a better job of keeping 'riff-raff' off of the casino floor. (This is a strip problem just as much as it's a downtown one).
    3. At night, please turn the music down...you know, just a little bit... I'd like to actually be able to converse with my fellow players and even with the dealer from time to time.
    4. Be willing to open a different table in the mornings when there's an empty table-game with a dealer doing nothing. (Think an empty Let-it-Ride table, while there's no 2-deck blackjack available). I would think me & my buddy's $10 blackjack bets would be more profitable than 7 empty $5 seats at the Let it Ride table.

    Now, except for #4, I'm not sure if any of my other 3 ideas would make them more money, but it would certainly make their casinos more appealing to people in my demographic.
     
    Seems like forever from now, but the flights are booked, so it counts!
  15. makikiboy

    makikiboy VIP Whale

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    As others have mentioned, this board is only a small group of people. We are very informed about vegas and what's going on. We also are smart players who (most of us anyway, lol) won't be conned into playing 6/5 bj.

    1. and 2. Management knows that we are in the minority in vegas. Their livelihood doesn't rely on smart players like us, rather they make a lot more on the players who will play 6/5 bj. They don't have to work as hard as they have to with us smart players. Until the 6/5 tables are always empty they will continue to offer it because the general public still plays it. They don't (and won't) miss us because their tables are still filled. I would think that many casinos think that 6/5 bj was one of the best marketing decisions they made since people are still playing it and they really didn't have to do much to implement it.

    3. I think that one of the reasons for the resort fees is because of competition. If you go to many search engines like kayak, orbitz, etc. you can list hotels by price for the dates of your stay. The hotels want to make it seem like they have the lowest prices on the net so it shows up over the other hotels. They also catch the ignorant people who aren't aware of the resort fee. If they were to put their actual rates and include all fees then they may not have the lowest rates on the sites and thus customers will book another hotel that has lower rates on the internet. While this doesn't seem a big deal apparently it is enough for them continue with this "con".

    As with most of us here on the board, we always factor in the resort fees in our decisions. Even with the resort fee some people will still stay at the hotel. As for me, if the rates are competitive I will consider staying at the hotel (the plaza is an example, if the rates with resort fees added in are competitive with other dt hotels I will consider staying there again).

    4. Vegas reinvents itself every so often. They tried it years ago with the "theme" resorts. they then tried to go with the "family" concept until they finally realized that families don't have a lot of money to burn. This newest phase is to go after the younger crowd. this group is willing to spend extra on things and are more willing to play 6/5 bj than the older generation. If you notice, many of the strip hotels and casinos offer many attractions (clubs, party pits, etc.) that cater to this crowd and downtown is also staring to cater to this group.

    As we see with the Luxor especially, the niche market is overrated and the Luxor had to change their theme because it wasn't bringing in customers. Making money is job 1 for the hotels and casinos and so they will do just about anything that will bring in the money.

    5. You have to understand that check out is normally (around) noon. The hotel then needs to have housekeeping clean and prep rooms for the next group of guests. As others have mentioned, many of the hotels on the strip will allow early check in if rooms are available. Some of these hotels also offer early check in for a fee because a number of guests come in early, another way of creating revenue without much effort.


    I agree with most of your issues but I'm a realist and understand their reasoning for the 6/5 bj, resort fees and everything else. Hotels and casinos are more interested in their bottom line - making money. Benny Binion was another time and another generation and I do agree that many of the older priorities like quality customer service and treating customers as valued commodities are superseded by profit margins and dividends to shareholders.
     
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