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Sheldon Adelson backing ban on online gambling.

Discussion in 'Casino Industry & Development' started by DReynolds86, Feb 6, 2015.

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  1. DReynolds86

    DReynolds86 Come On, You Blues!

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    http://www.onlinepokerreport.com/11725/graham-chaffetz-introduce-anti-online-gambling-bill/

    Also spearheaded by Lindsay Graham (R-SC) and Jason Chaffetz (R-UT). I don't recall seeing anything in the Constitution about the Congress or House having the authority to regulate gambling. Sounds like the "Why won't anyone think of the children?!?!?" types are out in force and looking to keep adults from choosing how and where to spend their money online. Personally, I want the government as far away from regulating the internet as humanly possible and I think we can all guess as to why Shelly wants this act to go through. Guess Venetian/Palazzo won't get any of my money come April.
     
  2. shifter

    shifter Degenerate Gambler

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    The way business works.

    10 min before this thread is locked...
     
  3. thecarve

    thecarve Misanthrope

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    Ditto.

    Though I do find it interesting that this is the headline from this week that gets you up in arms...
     
  4. tringlomane

    tringlomane STP Addicted Beer Snob

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    Adelson has been opposed to online gambling for years. Worried it will chip away at his cash cow instead of possibly enhance it.
     
  5. Brewfangrb

    Brewfangrb Low-Roller

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    I do think it's interesting that Adelson's politics are consistently about smaller government, less taxation, less interference with corporations, etc. And by interesting, I mean "typically hypocritical". When another corporation does something that could potentially negatively affect his business, it's the worst thing ever--and the only thing that can stop is government regulation. Improving the lives of workers and his customers....that's government meddling. This guy can self-deport into the sun, forthwith.
     
  6. waverunner

    waverunner BBHMM

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    I'll close it......LOL.

    "This game's in the refrigerator: the door is closed, the lights are out, the eggs are cooling, the butter's getting hard, and the Jell-O's jigglin'!"
    Thanks Chick Hearn, RIP.
     
  7. Kickin

    Kickin Flea

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    Yup, Adelson acts like a big libertarian only when it suits him. Ideology gets put on hold when he wants the government to protect him from new competition. I remember in late 2008 during the credit crisis he was on CNBC fuming that the government should bail him out, literally him directly. Some sort of blend of socialism and kleptocracy. Not to mention he should be jailed for some of the stuff he's pulled in China.

    Just a few of the many reasons I try not to patronize V/P.
     
  8. dmr

    dmr Registered Abuser

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    What he (she?) said!
     
  9. Someone

    Someone High-Roller

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    online gaming is going to turn out to be a major bust he is doing most casino companies a favor and they just don't know it yet

    the few places that online gaming has been legalized it came nowhere close to projections and just like all things "casino gambling" and similar the answer to that lack of major increase in business was "we just need to get it legal in more places before it will really take off"........but of course once that happens it won't take off and there will be some other silly excuse

    online gaming will also suck for the vast majority of people that really "crave it" they will end up broke and their dreams of being the next fil ivey will be dashed and crushed especially when they find their internet connection sucks, their computer is filled with bugs and viruses and crashes a lot and none of that is the problem of fog dawg gaming or whatever poor odds, fly by night, pile of crap they decided to do all their major, huge, big time gaming with because they offered the cheapest option......their comps will be nothing and they will have nothing to show for all the money they flushed away....... and when that very very very small crowd of low rollers and "front pocket rich players" dries up so will online gaming

    those I feel the most pity for are the ones that do tech support for major ISPs that are going to be flooded with calls about all of the issues most online gaming morons will have with the service and the online gaming companies will of course blame it on their internet connection over and over and ISPs will be flooded with calls from broke desperate dunces

    online gaming reminds me of an some idiots in the state where I live that want to allow liquor stores to open on Sunday because of the "increased tax revenues it would generate"

    of course their math consist of "open six days a week generate X dollars a week divide that by six and then multiple by seven and subtract the amount from when it was 6 days a week and boom big new money"

    they can't possibly work with the concept that most people that are not raging alcoholics and or total and complete binge drinking drunks are well aware that liquor stores are closed Sunday and have been since forever and thus anyone that is not a total dumbass is able to plan for that reality and find a period of time during the other six days of the week to make their purchase and anyone that either can't work with that reality or can't hold back enough liquor from the other 6 days of the week to make it through Sunday is probably not the type of person that should be catered to with increased access to libations and they are probably going to be more of a long term burden on society VS a major generator of new taxes once their alcoholism catches up to them

    hell even liquor store owners are against it because they realize it will bring no real marked increase in overall business it will just be one more day they have to be open and staffing the store and probably dealing mostly with the drunken dregs of society

    the guy that has to get in a few throws of the bones between checking the kids homework or has to play a few hands of online poker while eating his hot pockets is not going to be a long term source of major new revenue he will be a short term boost until he is tapped out for good and eating ramen noodles or mac and cheese without the cheese

    and really the easily to verify PROOF of what I am saying is Atlantic City and other similar areas.....new markets open for gaming and instead of "tapping all that unrealized market potential and all of that untapped pent up gaming demand" it only shifts gaming from existing locations to locations that are closer to the area people are coming from and repeat over and over

    it has been that way for over a decade and that will not change.....there are not masses of untapped and unrealized potential gaming dollars out there just waiting for a place to be wagered there are only those (mostly desperate) gamblers that are looking for an easier place to gamble what they already gamble or a closer place to access and any (even small amount) of possible "new dollars" will come at the expense of something else and at this point and time probably not even something else discretionary or entertainment related, but more likely something important like the rent or retirement or savings or utilities
     
  10. smartone

    smartone VIP Whale

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    Someone... I absolutely LOVE your well-thought out well written posts! I agree with you on the on-line gaming and was struggling with a way to say it, but now don't have to... you did it for me. I don't agree with you on the alcohol sales take though, but do appreciate your points. Living in Nevada, you can buy booze anywhere at anytime 24/7/365 and we're not exactly a state full of poorly-educated, mobile-home dwelling alcoholic excessive gamblers... ohhhhh wait... maybe we are?
     
  11. Someone

    Someone High-Roller

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    to be clear I am not saying anything against people that drink since I drink (moderately I am a light weight) myself and I have even been employed in the beverage industry

    what I am saying is there is not pent up demand for people that NEED for liquor stores to be open on Sunday and that there will be little of any appreciable increase in alcohol sales or taxes collected from liquor stores being open on Sunday and I am saying that anyone that can't properly plan for liquor stores not being open on Sunday and or can't buy alcohol in advance and refrain from consuming it until Sunday probably needs to look at their alcohol consumption and their self control

    places where you can buy liquor 24X7 are no better or worse than anywhere else, but if those places are seeing any appreciable increase in taxes collected from increased alcohol sales I would suspect they are also seeing an increase in some issues associated with that because the amount of sales increase from that ready access is most likely going to be catering to those with the least amount of self control....ask a Vegas cop (especially those that were a cop elsewhere before Vegas) they talk about it all the time how in Vegas they see issues 24X7 that back where they were from they only saw at particular hours of the day and night and it is because of a 24X7X365 lifestyle and not just drinking and gambling, but the availability of pretty much anything anytime anywhere means those with the least amount of self control have the easiest ability to show their lack of control most often

    again just like gambling......if you can't save up and make it to a casino (in one of the multitude of casinos littering the countryside) then you might not need to be gambling.......it you don't have the wherewithal or motivation to leave the house and go gamble I suspect a very large % of those people are going to have an "issue" with gambling

    I know I know some shift worker is going to come on and let us all know how they get off at 3am and appreciate "a beer after work" (as if they can't buy it ahead of time and have it in the fridge at home) and then they will say "yea but I like to go to a bar after work"......fine but that is not what is being talked about.......it is gambling AT HOME not at a casino or in the comparison I made buying liquor in a store not going out to a bar or club

    also to gambling and online gambling.....I would suspect (though I am too lazy to check) that most that are in favor of online gambling also love to post stories about how club, restaurant and bar sales as a % of revenues are larger and larger compared to gambling as a % of revenue and how those that like good gambling odds and Vegas (and elsewhere) that caters to gambling first need to "get with the times"

    but again cosmo, sls, downtown grand (to a degree) and revel prove that "casinos" without decent gambling and clubs and restaurants are not going to solve the issues with casinos and gambling and revenues and profits and even more so how on the one hand can you promote Vegas (and elsewhere) as an "entertainment destination" and bars and clubs and restaurants as a savior for the industry and then turn around and expect that online gambling (people sitting home chain smoking in their tightie whities giving their money away) is going to be a big savior for the industry........those concepts are diametrically opposed to each other and sls, cosmo, revel and downtown grand are not profitable with clubs, restaurants and bars as the main focus and in fact they are going broke.......maybe they need online gaming to save them :thumbsup:

    the industry is tapped out that is the issue and the bigger issue is casino companies are still spending hundreds of millions to build new locations to compete with their old locations and now they expect that online gambling will somehow not do the same

    there are only so many dollars out there for drinking, gambling, clubbing, movies, pro sports, college sports, cable TV, eating out at fancy restaurants and all the like......offering more options of the same only serves to spread the available dollars thinner for all the available venues and choices and at some point if you are capturing a few "new" dollars I suspect those dollars are coming from things that are not discretionary in nature like food, rent, savings, child care and the like

    at some point as an industry and even as a society you have to recognize there are not endless dollars waiting to be captured for non core, non discretionary venues and trying to make it so is damaging because there are those that lack self control and when they crash they bring others down with them they do not do so in a vacuum and the only way there will be more discretionary dollars to spread around is for there to be an increase in productivity and or the production of core products and services

    no matter how hard you try there is never going to be a society that functions based on chain restaurants, movies, casinos, bars, clubs, fancy restaurants, fashion retail, disney land, sports and the like....everyone can't be employed in a job that caters to everyone else being entertained and having fun

    and unless there is production of things that are not "having fun" related the dollars available for having fun are not going to materialize even if there is an increase in population...... and with an increase in population that is not itself productive there will probably be an actual total decrease in available dollars for discretionary spending as the cost of goods rises and those that had available discretionary income see more of that spent on non-discretionary items and those that had little or no discretionary income see it go to zero and or their lifestyle of subsistence becomes harder and affords them even less
     
  12. DReynolds86

    DReynolds86 Come On, You Blues!

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    Either way, Sheldon Adelson is a ******.
     
  13. UKFanatic

    UKFanatic The Arbiter of Taste Caviar Kid

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    Alright folks, in an effort to keep this thread open for 11 minutes instead of 10, we are removing the off topic posts and political commentary. Everyone remember the Board rules as it pertains to political discussion: http://www.vegasmessageboard.com/forums/showthread.php?94821-Forum-Rules-Updated-7-1-2013

    Feel free to discuss the merits of online gambling, your opinions on Adelson, and your opinions on V/P. But please steer clear of posts about what the government or politicians should or should not do. Political discussions are one of the few topics not permitted on VMB. There are plenty of other message boards and outlets to have that discussion. Thanks
     
  14. 44inarow

    44inarow VIP Whale

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    Yikes, I'm surprised this one got out of hand so quickly!

    What bugs me most about Adelson's position on this is that it's directly contrary to what he's doing in his own house. The V/P sportsbook is a Cantor Gaming operation. They've had online smartphone-based betting for years, and Sands has even put out press releases touting that. If you're going to call for a prohibition on something for largely moralistic reasons, then I personally think you shouldn't be offering it yourself, especially when most of your competitors are doing just fine without it.
     
  15. Nick61

    Nick61 High-Roller

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    Imagine the tax revenues that could be generated, if they only allowed sports betting throughout the country.
    The amounts would be astronomical.

    But, they somehow believe outlawing the act keeps people from doing it. They feel this obligation/compulsion to protect us from ourselves, lol.
    It was the same brainless theories espoused during prohibition.

    You can legally buy and possess freaking marijuana in many parts of the country now. But if I wanna bet the Warriors on a basketball game here in Missouri, I'm a criminal. Go figure.
     
  16. chitownjohn

    chitownjohn High-Roller

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    Does on-line gambling represent the complete suite of games found in the casino, such as slots, VP, BJ, roulette, bacc, craps, roulette? If that's the case wouldn't on-line gaming result in further deterioration of gaming in casinos, elimination of gaming positions across the board? As a fan of Vegas , I'm against it.
     
  17. DReynolds86

    DReynolds86 Come On, You Blues!

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    The other side of the coin is that it might make Las Vegas work harder for gamblers. If I can sit at home in my sweats and play 3:2 DAS blackjack on Bovada, why wouldn't I? I understand that Las Vegas properties have been shifting their focus from gaming revenue to non-gaming revenue but I don't know if this is because of the economy or if they were preparing themselves for online gambling.
     
  18. chitownjohn

    chitownjohn High-Roller

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    If people are playing BJ on their smartphone casino's will reduce BJ tables on the floor which reduces the options for the gambles that are looking for live action. Greater supply gives the gambler more options, reduced supply chokes options which is a negative for the players.
     
  19. 44inarow

    44inarow VIP Whale

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    Personally, I think it's neither, they basically just figured out that they could make significant money from the non-gaming sides of the business (i.e., the restaurants, shows, shopping, etc.) that were always looked at as just amenities for people to use while not gambling. Originally the business model was built around gambling, and things like restaurants were necessary because people were needed to eat. Buffets, for example, were always seen as a loss leader until Steve Wynn opened up the one at Bellagio, which makes great money. Now you've got bars with $20 cocktails, restaurants where you can easily drop hundreds of dollars a person before drinks, the sort of shopping you won't find outside of the highest of high-end places, etc. When you add the recent growth of EDM and the bottle-service nightclub scene, the percentages shift even more in favor of non-gaming revenue.

    That being said, the mistake that a lot of recent places have made is to focus too heavily on non-gaming. Just because they're making a higher percentage of their money from that sector, doesn't mean they can cut it out entirely.
     
  20. Aces and Eights

    Aces and Eights VIP Whale

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    I don't think they should ban on-line gaming since I believe people should have that choice. But I wouldn't participate in it because of the reasons I have for going to Vegas to gamble. I love the atmosphere of the casino... the scantily-clad women, the lights, the women with short skirts, the sounds, the cocktail servers (and their legs), interaction with the dealers and other players, the lustily-dressed women, the chips, the restaurants, the shows, and lastly the women.

    On-line gaming appeals to many, some of which I know. I don't think it will affect Vegas too much, simply because it can't replace the experience of Vegas. And other entertainment venues (albeit combined) in Vegas have surpassed gaming as the top revenue-getter. Of course they still have to have gaming as it makes them different from other resort areas. It's not the same as how internet shopping has affected brick-and-mortar shops. I think of internet gaming replacing casinos like getting a backyard pool to replace a trip to Hawaii.
     
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