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No BLEEP Sherlock story of the day

Discussion in 'Misc. Vegas Chat' started by leo21, Aug 20, 2015.

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  1. leo21

    leo21 VIP Whale

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  2. Joe

    Joe VIP Whale

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    Thanks for posting that. I got a good chuckle!
     
    Christmas
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  3. Mirageluvr

    Mirageluvr Low-Roller

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    Debate over tighter slot machines

    I wonder if this hold percentage has seen the same increase in Vegas? Very interesting. :grrr:


    Debate over tighter slot machines


    Aug 20 2015, 12:32 ET | By: Clark Schultz, SA News Editor


    A new report from the Association of Gaming Equipment Manufactures argues that tighter slot machines have contributed to a drop in revenue.
    Slot hold percentages increased 6.2% from 2007 to 2014 as total slot revenue fell off.
    Despite a variety of economic factors in play, the higher hold percentage is seen as diminishing traffic and reducing the overall time visitors spend in a casino. Some analysts have suggested a disconnect between slot machines and the interests of the under-30 generation is a larger factor.
     
  4. ken2v

    ken2v This Space For Rent

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    I'd say it is the latter. Go to any locals casino, where the supposedly savvy play, and watch 'em line up with rabbit's foot and a 6/5 DDB platform when two machines over it is 10/6.
     
  5. shifter

    shifter Degenerate Gambler

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    it's not necessarily obvious.

    increasing prices (hold) often does increase revenue.

    but you have to find the sweet spot.

    Vegas is still the best value.
     
  6. Mirageluvr

    Mirageluvr Low-Roller

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    Good article about this study on vegasinc.com. Vegas still has the lowest hold percentage at 6.4%, but it's higher than 2007. Florida has actually seen their hold % drop from 9.5% in 2006 to 6.41% in 2014. I will only play in Florida, AC, and of course Vegas. In Maryland the hold rate is the highest in the country...I will not play in Maryland where I live.
     
  7. TXactuarial

    TXactuarial Low-Roller

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    That seems really low for a hold percentage. I would expect an average hold to be north of 30%.
     
  8. Chuck2009x

    Chuck2009x VIP Whale

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    Depends on how they arrive at the 6.2% increase. I don;t think they're talking about holds going from 5% to 11.2%

    If the hold on a slot machine was 8% and you increased that by 6.2%, the new hold would be 8.5%. Nobody's going to notice that except the casino.
     
  9. tringlomane

    tringlomane STP Addicted Beer Snob

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    Unlike table games where hold is defined as:

    total chips won by the casino / total amount of chips purchased at the table

    Hold via slot machine is defined as:

    total amount won by casino / total amount wagered through the machine

    Now if slot hold was reported as...

    total amount won by casino / total amount input into the machine

    then yes, that rarely reported statistic is roughly in the 30% range.

    As for missouri, things haven't changed too badly from about 6 years ago:

    July 2009...9.054%
    June 2015...9.36%

    Generally slot win% has been creeping up as newer games have gradually been set lower.
     
  10. Chuck2009x

    Chuck2009x VIP Whale

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    I just saw the actual numbers from the report flash in a sidebar on Bloomberg TV. They said the "portion of slot wagers kept by the casinos" rose from 7.25% to 7.7%.

    So there's your 6.2% increase. Over 7 years.
     
  11. nostresshere

    nostresshere Mr. Anti Debit Card

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    In past years, I would play lots of slots. Drop thousands. Over the last handful of visits, thenumber of W-2's has gone way down. And I am betting higher denomination. Not gonna call it luck (or lack of) after multiple visits. The payout has dropped and my pay-in has just about gone away. I am now passing up suite offers with $1000 freeplay. Can no longer see any reason to drop all my money.

    Glad it worked for the idiot bean counters.

    They will be okay, until the other idiots stop buying $100 dinners and $300 bottle service and $30 drinks.

    Sorry, that is from my end and I am in the AARP crowd.
     
  12. zing

    zing Low-Roller

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    Every casino wants higher and higher hold percentages, but that's just going to cause customers to lose and have a bad experience which can't be good for business. If I were running a casino I would want players to play a long time, having a blast - while still losing money slowly over time.
     
  13. C0usineddie

    C0usineddie VIP Whale

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    Alot of the newer game make no sense so to me and I am sure I am not alone. I never play them because i dont know whats going on.

    Now add in that they have all sorts of other stuff going on like shopping and clubs and the like and there you go.

    I am sure the average bottle service patron is worth way more to a casino then a blue hair playing a slot.

    Casinos can basically sit empty almost as long as people are paying rent for stores , restaurants and clubs. Look at SLS. lose 45 million bucks and shrug it off. i dont think a few slot pulls really makes that much of a difference to them.
     
  14. Mirageluvr

    Mirageluvr Low-Roller

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    We were in SLS last week and it was dead. The private equity firm bankrolling their losses will expect a reduction of losses soon or they will pull the plug. A 45M quarterly loss is unsustainable over time, and time is running out.
     
  15. leo21

    leo21 VIP Whale

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    Yes, but when you ask customers why they stop coming or gamble less, the slot hold and crappy table rules are cited often. Maybe it's me. but it has to be easier to make money in a casino if there are more potential victims in those chairs.
     
  16. Nevyn

    Nevyn VIP Whale

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    Crappy table rules are easy to readily observe. Slot hold is not.

    And in any case, it is just like raising the price on merchandise. You sell less, but selling less at higher price could = more profit. Its not always an easy calculation.

    Finding the impact of slot hold is tough because you need to analyze the reasons people didn't come or spent less on a macro level. For instance, you could reduce the hold on your machines by 1% across the board, and still have a visitor hit a bad run, say they are never coming back, and say online that you tightened your slots.

    That's why they have to pay outside experts to do a big study, and why the study wavers and suggests it "may" be a reason.
     
  17. Electroguy563

    Electroguy563 Over-Fried Gambler

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    I agree. Some businesses keep prices low and depend on high customer turnout to make a profit. I like this concept because happy customers do something for the business that costs nothing. They advertise through word of mouth and drums up more business.

    Imagine a casino with many happy gamblers. They are gonna go home and tell people about you. Simplistic way to look at a business model but if you keep it as a goal and tweak the other aspects of doing business (labor, expenses, advertising, etc.) it can happen.
     
    Going to Hawaii's 9th Island!!
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  18. smartone

    smartone VIP Whale

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    If I've learned anything in my brief few years here on the VMB... it's to ALWAYS do what the older folks say needs to be done... they know!
     
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