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Table Games Load The Bases With Don't Come Bets

Discussion in 'Table Games' started by joe57777, Aug 9, 2012.

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  1. joe57777

    joe57777 Newbie

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    If someone wanted to play just the Don't side via the Don't pass and the Don't come, what would be the smartest and most profitable way to accomplish this? For example: (On a $5 min table) If you wanted to just bet $6 every time starting with the Don't pass bet and then make 5 consecutive Don't come bets to "load the bases" so to speak so all the numbers are covered with $6 bets. (I am using $6 bets because I do not have the bets hedged and figure the bet is small enough where losing $6 would not hurt you as much). How would this strategy work? Meaning do you think that after playing this for 2-3 hours that in the end it would show enough of a profit to be worth playing? Or do you think that the $6 would get "picked off" too many times on the come-out rolls by the "Devil 7" and his partner the "Evil Yo 11" that this strategy would show a loss with a small buy in of $100 and that the wins from the 2 and 3 would not make up for those 7 and 11 losses? If so, do you think that there is a hedge(s) that you could play on the come-out to protect the $6 bets? And or is it better to bet $12 DP or DC followed by a $6 DC bet so that if 7 or 11 shows you would have a net win of $6 unless the point is made? Any ideas on how to accomplish this feat? Is there also a way to lay all the numbers on the come-out and profit from some kind of hedge that way. I don't care if I have to grind out small wins it will all add up over several hours! I am NOT a fan of the BIG lay bets or Don't odds bets because you are too vulnerable to getting WACKED for a BIG loss no matter how small you think the odds are that the number will not hit next roll. Those losses are very hard to recover on ANY bankroll when you are trying to grind out small wins! Any suggestions?
     
  2. theotherone

    theotherone Low-Roller

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    I would think you would take a beating on this but a shooter with a good bit of variance and throws alot of 7s you might Be ok.

    For hedging on the comeout I only bet a few dollars on yo. Big red is covered by your lay bets working and presumably by the DC bets (not sure if their working on CO).

    Just MHO -- I haven't played DC very much at all.
     
  3. WrongWayWade

    WrongWayWade VIP Whale

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    There is nothing wrong with continuous don't come bets. You're only playing against a 1.4% house edge on each bet. One thing that is neat is that when the 7 comes, you rake in payments on every bet on the table, and when you lose you only lose one don't come bets at a time. When you play 'right' and do continuous come bets you only win one at a time but lose all of them at the same time.

    If you have to leave for dinner soon this is a poor betting scheme. :beer: You may sit there for a long time with your advantage bets on the table and if nobody will roll a 7 it can take a long time for them to get them all picked off. You can take these down, of course, but that would be pretty dumb.

    After 2 or 3 hours you can't EXPECT to show a profit. The house has the edge. But if you don't lay the odds this is a pretty low volatility approach and you could last a pretty long time.

    There is some legend about Jimmy the Greek; someone once asked him when he was really old about what he'd do different, and he said "If I could do it all over again, I wouldn't lay the odds."
     
  4. mjamesp

    mjamesp High-Roller

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    Keep in mind that any bet you make on the craps table (except taking or laying odds) carries a house edge. Any kind of hedge increases the house edge against you.
     
  5. bedaniels

    bedaniels Low-Roller

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    Lay bets

    My preferences are to:

    Bet the don't pass for $5. After the point is established, lay 1X odds on the don't pass, and $5 on the don't come. Once the next number rolls take your odds down off the dont come and make another don't come with the money that was your odds.

    Come out seven you lose $5
    Roll 2 seven win dont pass plus odds, lose dont come
    Roll 3 seven win dont pass and first dont come, lose dont come plus $5
    Roll 4 seven win dont pass and both dont comes

    Instead of waiting for the dice to "load the bases" consider lay bets.

    If no one is hitting points (rolling 3-5 times before busting) lay the point for $30 (plus a $1 vig), then wait. If the point is 4 or 10 you make $15, 5 or 9 you make $20, 6 or 8 you make $25.

    Or lay the inside for $120 (plus $4 vig) $30 on the 5,6,7,8. The shooter would have to hit all the inside numbers for a total loss. If the shooter bust without hitting your numbers the total win is $86 after the vig.
     
  6. FoolsGold

    FoolsGold Tourist

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    As always, the best is to take advantage of the ODDS bet which requires a considerable bankroll if you are on the Don'ts.
    Nothing wrong with playing the dark side exclusively.
    I've done it on a fairly choppy table and it worked out okay.
    So good luck to you.
     
  7. joe57777

    joe57777 Newbie

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    Thank you for your suggestions. There are some VERY GOOD ideas here. But as far as laying odds, I do get worried laying bets and becoming vulnerable for BIG losses. I am a grinder and all I need to do is to find the best way to get past the come-out roll and get at least $6 to the don't pass and the don't come. I do, however, like the thought of one of the strategies mentioned that lays money across ALL the numbers until the 7 shows. I think this could be a way to also show a profit especially on a come-out roll when 7's are more likely to show especially if people are shooting for them! But as I say I am not looking to gamble here much, but to just find a mathematical "safe" strategy that gives me the best odds in my favor. And NO I am NOT simply looking to best the pass or don't pass with the maximum odds. Some people that say this may be forgetting that the more money you put on a crap table (yes odds included) the more money you can lose!!!!! Any more ideas or can we fine tune some of the ones you gave me please?
     
  8. theotherone

    theotherone Low-Roller

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    I am all about laying the 4 and 10. Mathematically they are going to hit less anyway. I keep them working on the CO which covers my don't come bet if the 7 hits.
    Like you said that's when 7 is more likely to pop up anyway since people are shooting and expecting it.
     
  9. Scahom1

    Scahom1 Tourist

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    Are Lay bets something that can be done at any time? I understand there is a commission when placing the bet, do the dealers inform you of it or are you supposed to have that ready for them to take? Is there a minimum bet for them? Usually I play table minimum on DP/DC and place 2-3x odds behind the number. Does it work the same way with a Lay bet?
     
  10. theotherone

    theotherone Low-Roller

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    I think you can lay bets at any time. Yes there is a vig that must be paid. I was laying $10 at a time and paying $1. But I'm not fully sure how that all works. The dealers will help you along though.
    I believe the minimum lay bet is table minimum. It's going to pay half of your bet so the more the merrier.
    For lay bets I haven't gotten into the odds much so I will defer to Someone else for that answer.
     
  11. Ben Jammin

    Ben Jammin VIP Whale

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    Betting the don't come

    Betting the Don't is mathematically converse to betting the Do or Pass Line. Once you make the come out roll on the don't the odds shift dramatically in your favor. The trick is making the come out roll, a 7 or 11 you're out. Craps 2 or 3 is an even winner.

    After any point you must Lay the odds if you choose. You're chances of winning your bet are better because a 7 comes more often than any other number. One might say, you win half as much, but twice as often.

    So, to spread the board you simply repeat your don't come bet until you've covered most or all of the numbers with at least double lay odds and wait for that beautiful 7 to come.

    The good part is when that 7 does come they pay off all your winning bets at once, and you get a big pile of chips.

    Not like when betting the pass line and odds, you have all the numbers covered and here comes that 7. Ouch! All your bets go away.

    However if the shooter gets on a roll and you have all your numbers up on the don't side you'll watch your fortune slowly fade away. It's not that bad, if you keep putting up those don't come bets you'll replace the losing bet and eventually the 7 will come, it always does.

    You might not win any new friends, but you might win a few bucks if the table is cold.

    I read Nick the Greek played the don't side exclusively.

    The odds are ever so slightly more favorable, and you really have to know the game in and out to play the dark side correctly. You will have more money out there, but you'll win more often, and when you lose it'll hurt, and it's slow torture. But when you hit, it's awesome. A bit more extreme than the pass line side I'd say.
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2012
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