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Video Poker Jacks or Better - advice needed

Discussion in 'Video Poker' started by gambler, Jan 15, 2014.

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  1. gambler

    gambler VIP Whale

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    Earlier today, I decided to check my JOB strategy to see if I was still sharp. On the Wizard of Odds trainer, I was dealt this:

    9 clubs, 7 hearts, J clubs, 10 diamonds, A clubs

    I held the jack and ace of clubs and got an error message saying I should hold the 9, jack and ace of clubs.

    The chart on Wizard of Odds gives this strategy:

    The Wizard's Simple Strategy
    1. Full house or better
    2. 4 to a royal flush
    3. Straight, three of a kind, or flush
    4. 4 to a straight flush
    5. Two pair
    6. High pair
    7. 3 to a royal flush
    8. 4 to a flush
    9. Low pair
    10. 4 to an outside straight
    11. 2 suited high cards
    12. 3 to a straight flush
    13. 2 unsuited high cards (if more than 2 pick then pick lowest 2)
    14. Suited 10/J, 10/Q, or 10/K
    15. One high card
    16. Discard everything

    Is the Wizard program wrong on telling me to hold the 9 of clubs, is there a rule I'm missing on his strategy chart or am I just not getting something?

    I can't make a straight flush with those 3 cards and I don't believe I should hold 3 to a flush over 2 high cards. Any ideas anyone?
     
  2. jimboguy

    jimboguy Blubbery Whale

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    Holding the 9 of clubs would be incorrect. Your choice to hold the J and A of clubs is the best hold. WinPoker suggests a return of 2.8372 units by holding the J and A of clubs, while holding the 9, J, and A of clubs would return 2.7336 units.

    You're still sharp!
     
  3. Viva Las Vegas

    Viva Las Vegas Ramblin' Gamblin' Man

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    The trainer is wrong. Three to a royal, yes. Three to a flush, no.

    You would NEVER hold an Ace and a 9, except with two other cards as part of a four card flush or as a two pair/full house, aces and nines.

    My advanced card 9/6 or 8/6 JOB (excluding penalty cards) ranks as follows:

    1. Full House +; 3OAK or Two pair.
    2. 4 card Royal Flush (RF) > Flush or Straight > 4 card Straight Flush (SF)
    3. 3 Card RF
    4. 4 Card Flush
    5. KQJT > low pair > 4 card open ended staight 2345-QJT9
    6. SF +1 gap > SF +0 gap
    7. QJ suited
    8. AKQJ
    9. Ace/High Suited or King/High Suited
     
  4. gambler

    gambler VIP Whale

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    Thank you, thank you Jimbo and Viva :nworthy:

    I'll be able to sleep tonight!!

    This was only the 5th hand I played in the training program and it was driving me nuts trying to figure out why I should hold that blasted 9!

    I do have the WinPoker program at home but just don't have access to that computer right now. I'll stop using the Wizard's program and just stick with WinPoker.
     
  5. Scot

    Scot Low-Roller

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    Are you sure you were playing Jacks or Better and not Double Bonus? When I run that hand through the Wizards app, it reports the values correctly.

    I have played over a hundred thousand hands on the Wizards iphone and ipad app, and have never run into a discrepancy like that.
     
  6. tringlomane

    tringlomane STP Addicted Beer Snob

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    I can virtually guarantee the Wizard's trainer was correct as well. Because I am 99.9999% sure that OP was training himself on "short coining" 9/6 JoB where the royal only pays 250 for 1 instead of 800 for 1.

    When NOT playing max coins on 9/6 JoB:

    3 to a flush w/2 high cards > 2 to a royal
     
  7. Scot

    Scot Low-Roller

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    That makes even more sense! Basically, playing a single credit.
     
  8. gambler

    gambler VIP Whale

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    I checked and it is a "short coining" training program. I thought I was playing max bet but from what you say tringlomane, it had to have been set to one coin as that's the only way to explain what happened.

    So if it was set to one coin play on a short coining machine, you're saying the correct decision would be to hold 3 to a flush. That has to be what happened as it's the only answer that could justify holding those cards.

    And to think I doubted the Wizard. Shame on me!

    Thanks for explaining that tringlomane. It was my mistake.
     
  9. tringlomane

    tringlomane STP Addicted Beer Snob

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    No problem.

    But since I am a nit, I did rush my answer a bit. The flush draw also needs to be Ace high to make it correct over two to a royal.

    When the Royal pays 250 at 9/6 JoB:

    3 to a flush with Ace and suited high card > 2 to a royal.
     
  10. TIMSPEED

    TIMSPEED !địt mẹ!

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    Or do like my wife and hold Ace/Ten suited and pop the royal (twice!)
    Lol
     
    Palace Tower Suite!
  11. Matty Ice

    Matty Ice Low-Roller

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    Better to be lucky than to play correctly I guess. :thumbsup:
     
  12. sceej

    sceej Tourist

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    You can work, hard, you can do everything right but

    ... no power on earth is more powerful than dumb luck. Dumb luck beats hard work any time every time but ... but ... but ... dumb luck has a very very bad habit of taking a walk just when you start to rely on it or need it most.
     
  13. ejeffo

    ejeffo Low-Roller

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    Not sure I understand why it has to be A high... What difference does it make? The best possible hand would be... a flush.
     
  14. tringlomane

    tringlomane STP Addicted Beer Snob

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    Ace + suited high card can only make one straight: AKQJT.

    King + suited high card can make 2 straights: AKQJT or KQJT9. This extra longshot straight is valuable enough to outweigh holding the third suited card.
     
  15. ejeffo

    ejeffo Low-Roller

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    I understand that... but your post says "3 to a flush with Ace and suited high card > 2 to a royal." My question is... why is it BETTER with an ACE? According to what we both agree on it would be a lesser hand than without it.
     
  16. tringlomane

    tringlomane STP Addicted Beer Snob

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    No, 2 to a Royal is worse with an ace because there is only one straight possibility. Worse enough that we would rather hold 3 to a flush instead when the royal only pays 250 for 1.

    so if you had Ah Jh 8h 7s 6d we would want to hold Ah Jh 8h

    but...

    if you had Kh Jh 8h 7s 6d we would want to hold Kh Jh.

    But one could always play max credits and not worry about this. :)

    Also when betting one credit on 9/5, 8/5, or 7/5 JoB, this weird exception wouldn't apply because the flush only pays 5 for 1.
     
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