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Table Games Is this a reasonable craps strategy. Experts help please.

Discussion in 'Table Games' started by voltron12, Jun 20, 2015.

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  1. voltron12

    voltron12 Low-Roller

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    I tried craps for the first time last vegas trip and did amazing. Just used a basic come and max odds style. A friend was playing next to me playing a crazy strategy this past weekend. He seemed to really have a lot less swings and when there was a hot roller, he seemed to make 2-3 times as much as me. For you craps experts, is this a viable strategy or was the 8 hour of sessions over 2 days a luck fest by him

    Pass line bet to start at 10.00. Then after the point is made he puts a 75 dont come bet out and 5.00 11 bet.

    After the next roll if it is not a 7, he makes a place bet on every number that isnt the point or dont come for 10 or 12. And max odds on the point. If a 4,6,8,10 is rolled for the dont come he puts 5.00 on the hard way for that number only.

    After the next roll if it is not a 7 or crap, he puts max odds behind and another come bet.

    He keeps repeating the process. If his dont come number hits and he is up, he just puts max odds behind that. If he is down he takes off all his odds and place bets and puts another 75 on the dont come and 5.00 on 11. Then after that roll he puts everything back on and puts odds on any numbers without odds out there yet.

    Anyone played or seen this kind of system before. The dealers seemed to really act like this was a pain for them. And he said you really have to watch you are getting paid for everything since you basically have most numbers covered at all times once you get going. The only time he really would get hurt is when his dont come was established. And it was rolled the easy way. He would then take everything off and put another 75 on the dont come. If a 7 was rolled the next roll, that seemed to be the biggest hit for his style. Another other time the most he really seemed to have to loss on a single roll would be around 90.00. And that would be for 1 roll only then after that everything would come close to hedging and a hot roller would bank for him. Am I missing something. It seemed like even the worst case scenerio I mentioned was off set big time by any kind of decent shooter.

    Another thing I liked about his style is we checked our rating at the end of the 2 days, and his rating was rated way higher than mine. In fact it was 3 times as high and we always played together for the 8 hours over the 2 day period.
     
  2. meyers67

    meyers67 High-Roller

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    Why do you think the dealers acted like he was a pain? It's an active strategy playing both sides. I'd say that on a hot roll, you will make more than your friend if you are pressing a little.
     
  3. voltron12

    voltron12 Low-Roller

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    I dont press. I usually play super boring and the only risk I take is on a hot roller I will keep playing come bets after I have odds on 2 numbers. So that is probably actually why he made so much more than me.

    I guess when I think about it the only time the dealers acted annoyed was when the table was really full.

    My major reason for asking if this is a viable strategy is because I will be back out next week again for the wsop. Since I am playing in events if I make any deep runs like earlier this month, I wont get much time at the tables. And since I low played them last time on 5 days of comped rooms, I dont want to do the same on 5 more days of comp rooms. It seems like if I have a couple days of deep runs in the wsop, I could get 2-3 hours in pretty easy on those days playing this strategy. And it will seems to really rate you higher. And on my days not playing the wsop I can play my normal play at bj, pai gow craps for 4-8 hours. I am very new to craps and love the vibe of the people playing and it is just a more fun game to play in vegas than blackjack especially these days. I cant believe how many people I play with these days yelling or cursing at the dealer and basically playing while looking miserable.
     
  4. Naturaleight

    Naturaleight High-Roller

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    If you're playing for comps, the best strategy that I implement is playing $100 (obv you can flucuate this amount based on your bankroll) dont pass/full odds, followed by continous $100 dont come full odds bets. The lower house edge is not the only reason it is so much better to play the dont come and dont pass, but it is because the variance is so much less. Whereas if you play the pass and come, a 7 just wipes you out completely. By comparison the shooter must hit each individual number that you have, to lose the dont bets.
     
  5. voltron12

    voltron12 Low-Roller

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    Thanks for the thought, and yes that does make the best sense for comps, but I cant stomach playing just the dark side. I know I shouldnt care what people think, but I have seen drunk people actually yell at the dark side player. Even though I am trying to find a good style to play for comps, I want to enjoy the table and have fun also. I am very novice when it comes to craps so maybe I just experience some things that usually dont happen, but I noticed drunk people doing things from just flipping off or yelling at the dark side player to saying they would like to punch him. I still dont understand why someone cares what someone else is playing since it doesnt effect them at all.
     
  6. LV_Bound

    LV_Bound VIP Whale

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    This could be why you didn't win as much.

    Any strategy is a good strategy if wining.
    If he lost his shirt you probably would have posted the same question but asked if its a bad strategy instead of a good strategy.
     
  7. voltron12

    voltron12 Low-Roller

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    Very true. But the reason I was intrigued but this strategy is when things were rolling bad, he seemed to not lose much. At least not as much as me. And looking back that could of been more of the reason he ended up ahead so much more than me. The swings seemed to not be really bad for him if there was 3-5 bad rollers in the row.

    So hoping some people have seen or played this strategy before and know if it is a a reasonable strategy or not.
     
  8. aa0154

    aa0154 Tourist

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    As much as I would like to discover a good craps strat, you can't beat the math gods.
    Sounds like he just had a good run and everything fell into place for him. He picked off his come beats before 7 out. Lost his Don'ts by hitting a hard way etc...

    All it takes was a seven on the second roll and he would be out $90. Few of those and his session would have been a little different.

    The dealers were frustrated because one player was taking up so much of their time. If the table was full, it was annoying to the other playes as well, waiting for him to move his money around so they can make a bet.

    Play what is comfortable for you and remember that the variance is all you can really control.
     
  9. LV_Bound

    LV_Bound VIP Whale

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    That is a good point.
    Most Craps players have experienced this during a session more times then we care to remember.
     
  10. TIMSPEED

    TIMSPEED !địt mẹ!

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    Just lucky is all...
    Two things are a killer (and if you play craps with any sort of regularity, you'll see this OFTEN)
    1.) PSO...if a shooter rolls a number, then immediately a 7-out, your friend is out $90.
    We've all seen this happen MANY MANY MANY times (especially a STREAK of 4+ PSO's)
    2.) If a shooter gets "hot" and happens to roll EASY numbers, this would start killing his Don't-Come bet at $75 a pop...don't forget the $5 hardway loss and the $5 Yo loss...

    The least volatile way to play is minimum on the pass line.
     
    Palace Tower Suite!
  11. FullBoat

    FullBoat VIP Whale

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  12. voltron12

    voltron12 Low-Roller

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    that is it exactly.
     
  13. voltron12

    voltron12 Low-Roller

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    Thought I would report for anyone who is interested. First buy in with this strategy I did amazing. started with 500 cashed out with just over 2000. I played for about 5 hours at the same table also. I could fool myself into thinking it was the strategy but anyone playing a decent strategy with maxing out odds bets would have won close to as much. There 2 different times when 2 shooters in a row rolled for 30-40 minutes. And a few 20 minute shooters in there.

    When I woke up the next day I couldnt wait to play again. Mainly because the action with this strategy is non stop and with the nice run from the day before I was confident which seems to help. The next 3 days were hit and miss. Had some 150-400 wins. Had a couple 100-250 losses and the biggest loss was 450.

    I ended up 1350 for the trip. But like i said I am not blind in seeing that the first big hit night was because of this strategy. The thing that this strategy did do was boost my TR tier. I made diamond. I usually make platinum but have never made diamond. I earned 4 times more tier credits than my old strategy. That had a lot to do with getting 1000 tier bonuses each day. But this strategy also seemed to help me ride out the really bad swings when people roll a point, roll one number then 7 out. Since I break even on this or make a little money. So it would keep me at the same table for much longer. I usually dont stay at the same table for more than 1-2 hours. This trip I was at the same table 3-4 times for 2-4 hours each time.

    My conclusion is this is no better strategy than most of the other basic strategies. But for me it is a way to be more aggressive with not as much risk as it seems. Which made it a lot more fun to play than the basic play a pass line and 2-3 comes bets with max odds.
     
  14. MTShooter

    MTShooter Low-Roller

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    Sounds reasonable and math is correct. Will give it a shot next week!
     
  15. voltron12

    voltron12 Low-Roller

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    watch the dealers closely. They forgot to pay my DC multiple times and would pull it back with all the other bets when a 7 would come. I would have to tell them and a couple of rude dealers would act like I didnt make the bet or it was already hit. It would always be early at a new table when they didnt see my strategy often or on a dealer change. Most dealers were solid and had no issues and were helpful. It was annoying to have to argue with a couple dealers and get the pit to come over. The pit would always make sure I was paid and since I played at the same casino most of the time, they knew I always played it and we didnt have to wait for a camera check or anything like that.
     
  16. FullBoat

    FullBoat VIP Whale

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    I would suggest making a couple of tips to the dealers right off if you're going to use this. It's more upkeep for them for 1 person than normal. Might cut down on the problems that might come up later on.
     
  17. gmunole

    gmunole Tourist

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    What is a good method to toke the dealer since this method is a little more labor intensive for them? A few two-way hardways? Pass line bets?
     
  18. Hobofrank

    Hobofrank Prime Minister of Idiocracy

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    Id mix it up with straight chip tokes, 6&8 place bets, C&E and the hardway of their choice
     
  19. LV_Bound

    LV_Bound VIP Whale

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    I played this too but on the wizard of odds free game.
    Was down $352 in 15 minutes and down $447 in 20 minutes.
    I can see why one would get a good rating with this strategy but I can lose that much with my own strategy. :wink2:
    Granted this was a very small sampling and would be interested to hear more real world results.
     
  20. voltron12

    voltron12 Low-Roller

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    I've played this strategy on wizard of odds for more hours than I would like to admit just to see if this strategy was legit. Before I left for my first trip using it I was cleaning up. I probably 8-10 sessions of 20-30 minutes each and every time except once I was ahead. Since I got back I have practiced at it and been down about 50% of the time. And some of the losses have been around 500-600 and pretty quick.
     
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