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Is there any reason NOT to use up your POINTPlay?

Discussion in 'Comps' started by Kickin, Feb 2, 2013.

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  1. Kickin

    Kickin Flea

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    I'm still unclear as to how POINTPlay accrues on MLife. On my trip this past weekend I earned about 244k tier points and about $85 in POINTPlay. I don't remember exactly, I just converted it to freeplay and played it down. I just read this site: http://www.examiner.com/article/comparison-of-m-life-and-total-rewards-comp-programs-las-vegas-i-m-life

    The numbers are a bit dated but they say they wouldn't recommend using POINTPlay to play because it exhausts your accumulated points. Is this true? I thought POINTPlay was simply cash earned to use as freeplay. That there was no comp benefit in letting them build up.

    Can anyone clarify? Also I can't find any info about the rate at which you earn POINTPlay. Does this vary by game and therefore is not publicized?
     
  2. Chuck2009x

    Chuck2009x VIP Whale

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    All the information on that site with regard to MLife is wrong and/or outdated.

    There isn't really any particular reason not to use them up every trip. You lose them if you don't play again within 12 months. I don't even understand what the guy is trying to say in the sentence about not using them.

    You get 1 point (1 cent) for every $3 coin-in on regular slots, 1 point for $10 coin in on VP.
     
  3. barnaj

    barnaj Low-Roller

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    The only reason i wouldnt use em up is if your home state has a casino you gamble at often and want to save the points for there. Or if you plan on going back to LV and want to build em up for one of them days when you're bustin' out! I usually build up $100 bucks or more playing the video keno on an average 4 day trip to LV. I usually use it my last morning and take the money for my cab to airport, etc. The only thing that sucks is that in vegas, they force you to convert your point play to freeplay. So instead of being aboe to cash out say 12500 pts to $125 cash, you gotta play it as freeplay and you might only end up winning $40-$50 bucks or whatever. Im headed out on Feb 12th to NYNY, so we'll see what i can build up this time! :beer:



     
  4. Kickin

    Kickin Flea

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    Thanks. But working backwards from these numbers if I had $85 in POINTPlay (i.e. 8500 cents) that would imply I had only $85k coin-in on VP (I barely played slots, just a random $100 in a $5 or $10 Top Dollar machine a few times). So wouldn't $85k coin-in on VP yield me only 85k tier points? Maybe a bit more if tier multipliers multiply tier points as well. There is no way I earned the rest of the 240k tier points in my blackjack play which was only 10 hours at $208 average (the numbers they told me). The BJ play should only be responsible for under 50k tier points.
     
  5. dunebug81

    dunebug81 VIP Whale

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    from my understanding we earn tier credits on the machines as follows:

    $3 of slot play gives you 10 tier credits
    $10 of VP play gives you 10 tier credits

    Now I think if you're gold/plat/noir you earn them faster but mlife is so goddamn confusing who really knows.

    I too am mostly a table games player so I dont many points but I do like the high limit slots so when I get $100 or so Ill cash it in.
     
  6. nostresshere

    nostresshere Mr. Anti Debit Card

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    Okay, here is what the reporter said:
    "Unless players have a gazillion points, we don't recommend this option because it can rapidly exhaust accumulated points based on our experience"

    And, he is very misleading. Sure, if you use them, they get "exhausted". But, there is not negative to that, other than they are gone. So?

    I think he is mislead in thinking those points have anything to do with either your tier credits, or even express comps.

    Another "old wive's tale".
     
  7. mike_m235

    mike_m235 Tourist

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    The reporter is an idiot. Use your point play.
     
  8. Auggie

    Auggie Dovahkiin

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    No, you should use your POINTPlay - they represent comps you have already earned so saving them is of no benefit.

    Even saving them for a future trip to the casino isn't worth it as you could play those points now, get the cash and put the cash to use or just put it aside for that future casino trip and if any kind of emergency comes up you have the cash on hand.

    Also the points expire and there is always that chance where you might be planning a next trip, but have to put it off for some reason or other (IE: my wife and I planned to do Las Vegas for Christmas last year, but she couldn't get the time off work and right now I am too busy with work to go).


    But for what the article said about not using them, consider: what if it was a buffet comp? or a free room? Are you not going to use them because it will exhaust your accumulated comps? Of course it will exhaust them, thats what happens when you use them up...
     
  9. barnaj

    barnaj Low-Roller

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    Yep. Its like not using using your express comps because you dont want to waste them. Then whats the point of having them? They are there to be used, and i assume if you have a history of not using comps, offers, etc., you'll stop getting them. :beer:


     
  10. Chuck2009x

    Chuck2009x VIP Whale

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    From your other posts, I imagine you probably get rooms comps, but you also get 25 Tier Credits for every $1 of hotel spend, so that may be where some of the Tier Credits came from.

    You're correct that $85k coin in on VP should earn 85k Tier Credits.

    10 hours of blackjack at $200, 100 hands/hour and a 1% HA, I'm guesstimating would earn about 32,000 Tier Credits.

    I think what the guy was getting at in that article was just that his own preference was to let the POINTPLAY pile up until you have some nice large number that you can get a decent slot session out of.

    I just went to the MLife website and saw a little quirk that I hadn't remembered.

    In order to play off your slot points, you convert POINTPLAY to FREEPLAY at a machine. The web site says that FREEPLAY is forfeited after 18 (not 12) months of no play. That implies that you can pile up POINTPLAY, and as long as you don't convert it to FREEPLAY at a machine, it doesn't expire.

    Express Comps expire after 12 months of no play. And I suspect it benefits you to use them up on each trip, because I think the MGM accountants hate having them on the books as liabilities, and so I think the larger your Express Comps balance is, the bigger the pressure is going to be on a host or an Mlife desk person to make you use them before they comp off anything on the back end of a trip, even if your play deserves it.
     
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2013
  11. Kickin

    Kickin Flea

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    Yes, our suite and meals were comped from an upfront offer so I didn't have any hotel spend other than tips at checkout.

    Am I correct in my understanding that only machine play earns POINTPlay while table play doesn't? From what I've read it sounds like every base point earned on a machine earns 1 cent in Express Comps and 1 cent in POINTPlay. While every base point earned at a table earns 2 cents in Express Comps only. Further, the tier bonus multiplier applies to Express Comps but not POINTPlay.

    So for instance if a Platinum video poker player earns 1000 real base points (before the 1.3x bonus) he would get the following?
    1000 * 10 * 1.3 = 13,000 Tier Points
    1000 * 1 cent * 1.3 = $13 express comps
    1000 * 1 cent = $10 POINTPlay

    I earned about 244k tier points on this last trip but only earned about $130 in express comps. Doesn't that seem low, just like the POINTPlay I earned?
     
  12. Chuck2009x

    Chuck2009x VIP Whale

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    Only machine play earns POINTPLAY.

    Machines earn POINTPLAY, Express Comps, and Tier Credits.

    Tables earn Express Comps and Tier Credits.

    The bonus multiplier does not apply to earning Tier Credits - you only earn them on BASE points.

    No, it's more like this

    $10,000 coin in on VP = 1,000 BASE Points = 10,000 Tier Credits and $10.00 POINTPLAY and $10.00 Express Comps

    Plus the Platinum bonus of 30% = an additional $3 in POINTPLAY and $3 in Express Comps, but no additional Tier Credits.

    For table games, I worked out an estimate for craps that translates into 0.16 Tier Credits (and $0.0005 in Express Comps) per dollar bet.

    If you play only machines, your POINTPLAY and Express Comps should basically always be equal, and your Tier Credits would lag behind a little, because they're not subject to the bonus multiplier.

    If you play a mix of tables and slots, your Express Comps should be higher than your POINTPLAY, and your Tier Credits will start to catch up with your POINTPLAY, because you earn ECs and TCs on tables, but not POINTPLAY.

    I agree that your TCs seem out of whack with your POINTPLAY, but you haven't said how much coin-in you think you did, so it's hard to tell whether your POINTPLAY is too low or your Tier Credits are too high.

    If the POINTPLAY number and the Blackjack rating they told you are accurate, your TCs seem high.

    Did your Express Comps balance end up being WAY more than your POINTPLAY balance? Maybe you somehow got rated much higher than $208 at blackjack.

    The only things I can think of is either you got rated higher at blackjack than they told you, or you mistakenly got some Tier Credits on your hotel folio that they haven't backed out yet.

    Edited to add: OK, I see where you got $130 in Express Comps vs $85 in POINTPLAY, so the extra $45 in Express Comps should be attributable to blackjack. But I did the math on how many Tier Credits that should have earned you and it still doesn't get you anywhere close to 244k.
     
  13. Kickin

    Kickin Flea

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    Thanks Chuck that clarifies it a lot! I was under the impression that the bonus multiplier applied to tier credits as well and reading other posts on this board it seems I'm not alone in thinking that.
    Those were the numbers and checking my MLife page they are still the same, other than the POINTPlay which is now gone except for like 12 cents because I played it down. I'm tempted to call MLife and ask if I I didn't receive all the ECs and Pointplay I was supposed to, I've read others had luck doing that. Though I guess there's also a chance they can say I simply received too many tier credits. But based on my VP play I think the TCs are probably accurate. I used to be only a table game player so I asked them about my avg bet and hours but never thought to ask them about my coin-in.
     
  14. Chuck2009x

    Chuck2009x VIP Whale

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    I used to think that too, but when I re-read the MLife site, it's clear that Tier Credits are based on Base points, and that Base points and Bonus points go in separate buckets, then get combined for purposes of your POINTPLAY and Express Comps balances.

    The tax info section of the MLife site hasn't worked in a long time, but they used to post win-loss on a quarterly basis by property, so you didn't have to wait until the end of the year to see your stats. I don't remember whether MGM broke down coin-in and coin-out. Venetian/Palazzo's yearly statements do that, CET's don't.
     
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