1. Welcome to VegasMessageBoard
    It appears you are visiting our community as a guest.
    In order to view full-size images, participate in discussions, vote in polls, etc, you will need to Log in or Register.

Hand Pay Question?

Discussion in 'Misc. Vegas Chat' started by Letsdoit, Feb 10, 2013.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Letsdoit

    Letsdoit Low-Roller

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2012
    Messages:
    220
    Location:
    Montreal
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    9
    Hi Everyone,

    This question is for the Slot players. I'm from Canada and we do not pay taxes on lottery winnings, however, when I get a hand pay in Vegas, I'm required to file a US income tax return to get back my 30% that was withheld. And, I'm charged 25% of my withheld amount from the company that does this for me.

    Here is my question. I noticed on my last trip in January that the person sitting next to me from California got a couple of hand pays and all the attendants did is remove her players card and paid her. She was not asked for ID. When I got a hand pay, they did the same. No ID and they came to pay me minus of course the 30%. It is just a pain in the ass to get the money back and I have to wait for the 2013 calendar year to finish in order to get back my 30% that was withheld in January 2013.

    Do your hand pays require id? Or, just your mlife card is sufficient?

    I'm asking this because if that is the case, I'll just change my address on my account to reflect my cousin's US address.

    Thanks in advance for you responses and your help!!!
     
  2. Joe

    Joe VIP Whale

    Joined:
    Sep 11, 2009
    Messages:
    11,309
    Location:
    Wisconsin
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    175
    Just a shot in the dark here...it is possible that even though it was a hand pay, it didn't cross the $1,199 level and therefore no ID was needed.

    At many casinos a $1,000 win requires a hand pay, but no ID is needed because it is not a taxable event.
     
    Christmas
  3. Letsdoit

    Letsdoit Low-Roller

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2012
    Messages:
    220
    Location:
    Montreal
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    9
    Hi joe

    No. Believe it or not it was 1200$ arghhhhh lol

    The lady next to me won 3400 and 1700 without showing id

    It is just frustrating when you are down and then you finally win a pot and have to have that amount withheld

    Do you have to show id? Or is your mlife card sufficien
    Cheers
     
  4. Joe

    Joe VIP Whale

    Joined:
    Sep 11, 2009
    Messages:
    11,309
    Location:
    Wisconsin
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    175
    On a hand pay over $1,199 I have to show my driver's license and also give my social security number. Most of my hand pays are at Boyd properties, but when I hit a $6,000+ at Four Queens, I had to do the same.
     
    Christmas
  5. nhcris

    nhcris High-Roller

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2010
    Messages:
    803
    Location:
    NH
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    28
    I always have had to show ID, but rarely have taxes been withheld on my handpays. I believe I have been asked a couple of times if I wanted them withheld, but I can't remember it ever being mandatory. I am a US citizen if that makes a difference.
     
  6. lmondun

    lmondun Low-Roller

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2010
    Messages:
    306
    Location:
    Southern California
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    75
    If you are a slot player who plays high enough at one place, you will get enough hand pays to assure that your tax info is readily available in the casino's system. At the highest levels, the casino will assign someone to document the hits so the player can plow ahead without stopping for the hand pay, as I understand it.
    P.S. Changing your mlife mailing address won't make you a U.S. resident. The casino will use your real address for the tax withholding.
     
  7. HAWJOHN

    HAWJOHN Tourist

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2010
    Messages:
    414
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    50
    I would just be making another guess, but would like to comment on using a United States address. A Social Security number would be required on payment of a win.
     
  8. Auggie

    Auggie Dovahkiin

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2009
    Messages:
    5,749
    Location:
    Burnaby, BC
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    14
    This doesn't really make sense, and in reading this my thought is that you didn't get a hand pay, but saw somebody getting one and you are wondering if the address change might be a way for you to get around the 30% withholding tax.

    With the woman from California what would be most likely is that she is a regular at the casino or has already received multiple hand pays from this attendant and so they don't need to see her info.

    In your case the part that doesn't make sense is: how would they know you are Canadian or not or that they should withhold 30% or not?


    For the MLife Card: what card is in the machine doesn't matter. Consider the implications if it did: lets say some guy is playing the Megabucks machine and tracking play on his card... he gets up and goes and forgets his card in the machine. I sit down at the machine and I don't use a player card so I don't think to even look if somebody else's is in there... and I hit the big $10M jackpot!

    There is going to be millions of dollars in taxes owed on this jackpot... if they go simply based on what card was in the machine that guy who left his card is going to owe millions of dollars in taxes and I'll owe nothing.

    And it doesn't have to be a big jackpot... if I am a high roller and just want to ruin somebody's life or skirt paying taxes I could just pick up a lost card from somewhere in the casino and use it and every time I hit a big handpay some chump ends up with my tax bill and I get 100% of the money.


    For a Canadian what happens when you get a handpay is they take your ID and go off and fill out the forms and then bring it all back with your money and then hand pay... the whole process can take 20-30 minutes.

    If you don't have any ID on you, like you are thinking of telling them that you are from the USA and just saying you forgot your ID at home or its in the hotel room or something, then what they will do is hold your hand pay at the casino cage until you come to produce ID and claim it or agree to give up 30% of it.


    As for reclaiming the amount withheld:
    You can go through a tax recovery company back in Canada, but it does cost money.
    The first time you use one of those companies they have to get you an ITIN number if you don't have one and thats why they charge so much on your first claim (shouldn't actually be 25%, but it can be pretty high on the first time you file). But then subsequent claims will be cheaper once you have your US tax number.

    But there is an alternative: You can apply for an ITIN number at the IRS website and download all the forms you need to file a US tax return and claim back your withholding tax. Just takes a bit of time, patience and helps if you have a website with a walkthrough on it showing you what to do and how to fill it all out.
     
  9. Letsdoit

    Letsdoit Low-Roller

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2012
    Messages:
    220
    Location:
    Montreal
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    9
    Thanks everyone

    I think the attendants knew the player like you guys stated

    You are right about playing with someone's card lol

    I did not think of that lol. No way around it but I will try to get more info on submitting it myself

    Wish me luck

    Cheers
     
  10. S'AllGoodMan

    S'AllGoodMan High-Roller

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2010
    Messages:
    562
    Location:
    CT
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    30
    You need to apply for a ITIN (individual tax identification number) and you will have the option to pay or not pay taxes on your wins. This also allows you to file a tax return to get any payment back.

    This will take the place of a social security number that is required for slot wins of $1200+.

    I have an idea that the women you saw had already hit some hand pays earlier. I know when I had several in the course of a few hours the attendants stopped asking for I'd as it was already on file for the paperwork.
     
  11. Julie888

    Julie888 High-Roller

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2008
    Messages:
    986
    Trips to Las Vegas:
    50
    In Nevada, withholding the 30% is not an option for Canadians. You have to pay it and submit a tax form for a refund.

    After you have the ITN, the first time filing will be the hardest. Just keep winning more handpays and you'll have it down pat.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.