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Diamond - Level 2 (40,000 Tier Credits)

Discussion in 'Comps' started by meyers67, Jul 24, 2013.

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  1. meyers67

    meyers67 High-Roller

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    I'm closing in on 40,000 tier credits, which will get me a free 4-night stay according to the website.

    Has anyone booked this? Will I be able to pick any time (such as NYE), or are there a lot of black out dates?

    Thanks
     
  2. paperposter

    paperposter VIP Whale

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    im cunfused cant you get that anyway at your level of play.:rolleyes2:
     
  3. dankyone

    dankyone VIP Whale

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    I'm confused too, that "4 day stay" seems to be the only benefit of the status. I can get 5 nights at any CET property anywhere any time already, so there doesn't seem to be any benefit to me. Maybe if your ADT is very low--say you go in every day and earn a couple of hundred tier credits--this might help you, but otherwise I can't see any tangible benefit for anyone at that level.
     
  4. Kickin

    Kickin Flea

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    Yes it is a confusing benefit because they don't list the terms. All it says is: Enjoy an additional complimentary four-night stay at any Total Rewards destination. This is in addition to any offers or comps Diamond guests receive based on their play.

    I reached level 2 while in Vegas and they mentioned it to me and gave me a flyer that just said the same thing as the website. They told me I'd be getting a letter in the mail which I assumed would have the details. But I never got a letter.

    I'm at over 50k tier and the site doesn't show comp rooms for me a lot of times on weekends at places in AC or a couple of times when I checked New Orleans, where I've never played. So I also wonder what the benefit means exactly. If I wanted to go to New Orleans can I just book the 4 nights there regardless of what the comp calendar says? It's odd.

    The next level is only at 80k which I didn't think I'd get to but I might. That has some real benefits like $750 airfare, limo transfers within 50 miles, companion card, parties, etc.
     
  5. paperposter

    paperposter VIP Whale

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    thts why all i care about is making diamond at 15,000 ,get free rooms and show tickets after that nothing else till you get to seven stars really matters so i shift may play to other properties so i cat differnt things from like mgm and palms and others
     
  6. meyers67

    meyers67 High-Roller

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    I play lots of VP so my ADT is low. No offers for me. Thats why I'm asking about the free 4 night stay.
     
  7. shifter

    shifter Degenerate Gambler

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    The earning rate on vp is already lower to adjust for the lower ha. So your adt should be plenty to reach 40k tcs. If you're not even getting free rooms whenever you want at that level, you're getting royally screwed.
     
  8. Kickin

    Kickin Flea

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    Not really. The tier earning rates aren't really correlated to theo. Same with MGM. For the same theos you get about 7x the TCs playing VP versus blackjack for example assuming optimal play and favorable rules. It's because for table games its based on theo but for machines it's based on coin-in. You get the same TCs for playing the lowest edge VP with optimal strategy as you do for playing the worst VP with horrible strategy. But you'd get very different theos.
     
  9. dankyone

    dankyone VIP Whale

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    Yes. If CET rated table play based on "total action" like "coin in" on VP, you would earn 1000 TCs playing $100/hand for one hour (100 hands.) Instead you earn 150 TCs. Theo for this play (the way I calculate it) is $100*100*.0026=$26. The way I think THEY calculate it, it is $100*70*.0075=$52.50 (roughly)

    Playing $10,000 through a full pay VP machine should yield a theo of about $50 and TCs of 1000. For this reason, if you are chasing tier credits for any reason you should play VP. Tables accrue too slowly and slots the house edge is far higher and you will just lose too much.

    Playing VP correctly, you can earn 7500 TCs in one day for a theoretical loss of $125. (25,000 coin in*.005 HA=$125.) With this play you earn 2500 TCs and a 5000 TC bonus in one day. Do this 20 times and you can be Seven Stars and theoretically have lost only $2500.

    Of course, VP is a high variance game and you could potentially lose tens of thousands. A royal only comes along about every 40,000 hands. If you play $5 machines (which you have to at CET for decent rules) that is $25/spin. Put your 20*$25,000 worth of play through, you have only played 20,000 hands, it is quite likely you still have not seen a royal, and you are getting buried.

    With slots you have probably lost $50,000+ with this play, with BJ about $8600 due to the slow accrual of TCs on tables. Of course most people don't play VP or BJ perfectly...
     
  10. casinoboy

    casinoboy Low-Roller

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    for comps a gold or plat player can get more comps then a diamond player,it all depends on adt and what you play. a slot player gets twice as many tier for coin in as a vp player so if they played half as much coin in they would have the same tier but they would have 10 times the adt and more comps. it all depends. the highest comps at cet go to penny slot players who play max coin. they have high adt and they play the game cet gives highest comps to.

    for the diamond aspirations level 2 hotel benefit you have to call to book it and its based on availibility but they will try to get you nicely taken care of. harrahs new orleans is a hard one to get weekend comps for even if you can always get the best comp rooms or suites in vegas. the new orleans harrahs has a lot less rooms and is in high demand on weekends,but if they dont have availibility they can also set you up in their partner hotels which are nice too like the marriott i think.
     
  11. LAV

    LAV Tourist

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    How do you know this? Oh wait! A host told your dad this. Um hmmm...

    Sure, when your parents play the maximum bets on the penny machines, it will certainly the the amount of coin in. With slots, it would still be your coin in per day.

    The exception, as you alluded to, would be that video poker has a lower earning potential than other slots.

    However, I don't understand when you say the penny slots have high adt and cet gives them the highest comps.

    First, I don't play slots (only video poker here and there), and I have a high adt.

    Second, anyone with a high ADT, be it they play tables or slots, will get good comps.
     
    Last edited: Jul 25, 2013
  12. nostresshere

    nostresshere Mr. Anti Debit Card

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    Really? Are you going by offers, or by the rate calendar?
     
  13. casinoboy

    casinoboy Low-Roller

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    yes it is what my dads host told him, if you dont want to believe it that is your business. anyone with high play will get good comps but he said if you get your adt from penny slots they will send you better offers then someone who gets the same adt playing good games like video poker, craps, or blackjack.im not making this up out of thin air this is from my dads longtime cet host of over 10 years and good friend.
     
  14. LAV

    LAV Tourist

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    OK, so tell me some of the "high comps" that your dad got based on his high ADT that other players of craps, blackjack, video poker players did not get with the same high ADT.

    I play tables almost exclusively, and I would love to know what other "high comps" penny slots players are getting that I am not. Heck, sometimes I think I get "good comps" based on my relationship with my host than my play, which can be weak at times, relative to what was offered.

    Young man, you are running with an assumption as if it is indeed fact based on what one host says. I can certainly tell you that a host does not know everything, and often times, they learn from players about offers, etc.

    And one other thing: I am very anal about providing accurate information on the boards so that others will benefit from the accurate information. So to say that if I don't believe it, then it's my business certainly does not jive too well. I would have to say that when I see information that may be be completely accurate, I would like to question or analyze it further.

    You want to know what factors go in heavily into "good" or "high" comps, as you put it? Your theo, time played, losses, and your relationship with your host. Some games earn higher theo than others, but you will not get better comps strictly based on the type of game that you play.
     
  15. casinoboy

    casinoboy Low-Roller

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    my dad doesnt play penny slots he plays good games and thats why he asked about it. he knew other players who probably had lower adt even though they played bad games but they were getting more freeplay and invites to more events and higher amounts on gas cards or shopping. so his host told him those offers are based on more then adt but also what kind of games you play and the casino likes to lure penny slot players the most. i dont know any of this personaly just what i've heard a host explain.
     
  16. nostresshere

    nostresshere Mr. Anti Debit Card

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    I would say that in 99% of the cases, you can take what others say about their level of play, and throw it out the window.

    Comments like:
    play the same as last time
    play the same as my spouse, brother, etc
    He plays way more than me
    he plays way less than me
    I hardly play at all
    etc
     
  17. waverunner

    waverunner BBHMM

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    The ADT score is something that only the bean counters can determine.
    I am at the lowest level (Gold), but i only play slots. I will be at Caesars next week comped for 5 nights. I was also comped at Rio in May, and comped again in November at Bally's. Looking at my rate calender for 2014, i am comped as most CET hotels. I go Sun-Fri every time, and don't have a Host.
    I don't need anything other than Gold to have a wonderful week. Perhaps it's because i only go solo and don't need "fine" dining. My RC's pay me each day for Coffee/Pastry, that is why my RC's are really low. My tier score is under a 1000 for the week in May........it will probably be the same next week (1000 + 1000). I know many people talk about the color of the card, tier and reward credits, etc., but to spend 5 nights in Vegas comped at a place like Caesars is a reward in itself.
    And by the way........at least in my case..........Caesars is comped, and will be comped, even though i never gamble there, but PH and Paris, which get's the bulk of my bankroll, is hardly ever comped, especially for a full 5 days.
     
  18. Guardian

    Guardian Low-Roller

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    My wife and I are both Diamond and each of us have secured 15500 tier credits this year on our individual accounts. She plays strictly penny slots and I play 80% VP and 20% slots. She gets more freeplay, more rooms, and extra offers I don't get. For sure they value penny slot players more than VP players.
     
  19. Kickin

    Kickin Flea

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    From what I've been reading casinoboy and Guardian are right, in a sense. In 'Addiction By Design', which largely focuses on CET, it details how their approach to calculating a player's worth goes way way way beyond simply ADT. In fact there is an incredible amount of data they're constantly collecting on you and triangulating with demographic data to predict your behavior and your worth. Here is a relevant passage from page 212 to what casinoboy and Guardian are arguing:

    Harrah's statistical models for determining player value, similar to those used for predicting stocks' future worth, are the most advanced in the industry. The casino franchise, which maintains ninety different demographic segments for its customers, has determined that player value is most strongly associated with frequency of play, type of game played, and the number of coins played per spin or hand. Gamblers exhibiting a high play "velocity" (i.e. those who hit machines' buttons very fast) are easily convinced to gamble more and thus are especially valuable to the company.

    I think part of this is semantics. What LAV is talking about is traditional comps which are 30% - 40% of theo. But there are marketing related comps as well that seem to be based on more complex algorithms. For us it doesn't make a difference what you call it, but someone like your host is going to just be responsible for the 30-40% of theo type comps and probably not be privy to how corporate-marketing is spending their marketing dollars on you.
     
  20. LAV

    LAV Tourist

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    Tier points have less to do with offers than you think. Obviously playing 80% VP will most likely get you less as her penny slots play will garner more theo in the same amount of time. Simply put, comparing your offers with your wife or to any other player based on similar tier status is not a completely accurate way to measure your offers. I can tell you that not all seven stars players get the same offers. While the conventional wisdom says that slot players get more than table players at CET, in my non scientific observations, some of the best offers that I have seen that certain 7 star players get are those who are table players. Why? Many of those 7 star players that I have encountered play very big. They play different games: bj, bac, craps, pai gow (as in my case), so their theo is really high. They get awesome comps that others don't know about.

    Myself and some of my friends play tables only. While I have a higher average than them, they still get the same offers, albeit in smaller amounts. If either they or myself do not have that offer, we could always ask our host to include us in that particular promotion.

    At no point will the discussion be, "Oh, this is the game that you play so I am going to give you a better offer."

    Additionally, when they suggest the type of game you play, they simply are referring to some games having a higher house edge than others, thus having a higher theo earning potential, which again outweighs any type of you game that you play.

    My casino games have evolved since the first time I achieved my seven star status. I used to play very high HA games, such as Carribean Stud, Crazy 4 poker, Big 6 (that dreaded wheel), and now just Pai Gow. My offers always remained very good because of my high theo. The only difference was that I earned 7 stars much faster, and that I may have had a higher theo when I used to play big 6 since that game garnered me so much theo for the same amount of time played and average bet compared to say playing bac, bj or pai gow.

    Again, anyone suggesting that a penny slot player is valued more than other slots player is not seeing the big picture. In the end, it's still your theo that is the main determining factor in your offers.

    The types of games will help with that theo based on their HA.
     
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