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Table Games Craps, paying to keep come bet up

Discussion in 'Table Games' started by wookie, May 2, 2012.

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  1. wookie

    wookie Low-Roller

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    I usually play pass and come. My plan (that I don't always stick to) is to bet up to two come bets up with full odds. Sometime if there is a seven on the come out after I have come bets up I'll pay to keep the come bets working. I never thought to ask, from an odds perspective how bad is this? I guess you lose the + on the 7/11 on the come, but how much of penalty is it? On a hot table I like keeping those come bets up (with their odds).
     
  2. larryg

    larryg Low-Roller

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    If you're playing at a 3-4-5x table, then a put bet with max odds on the 5,6,8 or 9 has the same house advantage as a place bet of the same total dollar amount.

    For a 4 or 10, it's better to buy the number (as long as you're betting $20 or more). I thought it was better to buy the 5 and 9 as well (2% house advantage versus the place bet's 4% house advantage), but I don't see players doing that.
     
  3. WrongWayWade

    WrongWayWade VIP Whale

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    Nah, don't do this. If you want that number, just place it. Giving up the 7/11 on the comeout of a come/place bet IS a big negative.

    Put bets have to have high odds multiples just to equal a place bet.

    From the Wizard of Odds:
    Much of the value in pass and come bets is in the come out roll, so skipping it carries a high house edge.

    6 and 8: Bettor must combine a put bet with 5X odds to have the same overall house edge of 1.52% as a place bet.
    5 and 9: Bettor must combine a put bet with 4X odds to have the same overall house edge of 4.00% as a place bet.
    4 and 10: Bettor must combine a put bet with 19X odds to have the same overall house edge of 1.67% as a buy bet, assuming the commission is paid on a win only. If the commission is always paid then the bettor must combine a put with with 6X odds to match the 4.76% house edge.

    At casinos that offer 3-4-5X odds, or worse, there is no reason to make a put bet, because you will do equal or bettor to make a place or buy bet.
     
  4. Hogman

    Hogman VIP Whale

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    I agree just make a place bet for numbers you want working. If you have 5 comes bets at $10 each and you put those bets back up then you lose that $50 again if another 7 rolls.
    Also at lower levels there is no advantage
    6-8 if you bet $10 with 50 odds =$60 pays $70 if you place for 60 it pays 70
    5-9 $10-40 odds pays $70 $50 place bet pays $70
    4-10 $10-30 odds pays $70 $40 place bet pays $78(80-2 VIG)

    my 2 cents
     
    First Trip 2017
  5. bedaniels

    bedaniels Low-Roller

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    While I have paid to keep come bets up in the past (several years ago) I agree with WrongWayWade, just place the numbers you want to avoid losing those bets on the come out 7. Plus place bets will increase your average bet earning you better comps because the odds bets usually don't count in your avg bet rating but place bets do count.
     
  6. Ben Jammin

    Ben Jammin VIP Whale

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    A come bet wins on a 7, as the line bets and odds go away, it's almost like you're hedging your bet as far as the come.

    Paying to keep then up after the fact may be counter productive.

    You're actually playing a game within a game if you will.

    Come bets are advantageous as long as those numbers keep coming, but that of course is not always the case.

    You'd have to have a PHD in math to calculate the ongoing percentages relative to the house edge on any given combination of bets up, the effect the come bet makes when it's up when a 7 is rolled offsets the player disadvantage slightly as you're actually betting against yourself on that particular roll, because if a 7 comes you win the come but lose your line and odds, as well as any place, buy, or put bets.

    It's very slight but it is there. At least you get a little bit back when you lose.

    The purist strategy is to bet one number and then take full odds on that number only, which would generate the absolute lowest house advantage but it would be boring and drive you crazy if the numbers kept hitting and you didn't have any other working bets up. But on the flip side, if you lost, as if a 7 came after only two or three rolls you could congratulate yourself on the brilliance of your playing acumen.

    Bottom line is;

    Either You're Lucky, Or You're Not!

    *
     
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