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Table Games Craps newbie queries

Discussion in 'Table Games' started by boofmichael, Jul 19, 2015.

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  1. boofmichael

    boofmichael Low-Roller

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    Hi guys, I've never actually played craps, but we're heading to Vegas later this year and I quite fancy giving it a go.

    I've been reading the rules on various sites (Wizard of Odds, etc) and I think I have gained a basic grasp of the game, but I a few queries or points that I wish to clarify:

    1. You can only place a pass / don't pass bet when the shooter is doing the Come Out roll, i.e. the first roll of the round. This is indicated by the chip showing "Off" on the table. Anyone, including the shooter, can bet on the Come Out part of the round. If I bet pass and it comes in 7 or 11 I win and if it comes in 2, 3 or 12 I lose. Opposite if I bet don't pass. Is this all correct so far?

    2. If the Come Out roll is 4,5,6,8,9 or 10 then nobody wins or loses on the pass / don't pass bets and the number rolled become the Point. This I get. What happens to the pass / don't pass bets? Do they get refunded or do they carry on until the round is finished, i.e. if the point is rolled again the pass wins and don't pass loses or if a 7 is rolled then the pass loses and don't pass wins?

    3. If the shooter rolls a point, then it moves on to the Point part of the round. Do players then need to bet on the Come / Don't Come to choose whether the shooter will roll the point or roll a 7? Or can players who have already got a bet on Pass / Don't Pass leave their original bet live and not bother betting on Come / Don't Come?

    4. Can I elect to gamble but avoid being the shooter or would that be classed as bad etiquette?

    5. Do I place my chips directly onto the table for whatever I'm gambling on, or do I need to tell the dealers what I'm betting on and/or get them to place my bets for me?

    6. As a newbie, am I right in assuming it looks better to bet on Pass and Come as opposed to Don't Pass and Don't Come as betting against the Shooter could make me look like a bit of an arsehole?

    7. Once the Point has been established, does the Shooter keep rolling until he rolls the point or a 7? If he hits the Point can he elect to start a new round again or is it mandatory that the die is passed on to the next player clockwise?

    8. What does the term "press" mean?

    Thanks in advance for taking the time to consider my rookie queries.
     
  2. Hobofrank

    Hobofrank Prime Minister of Idiocracy

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    You'll get the idea very fast
    but remember the 2 most important "fox pass' that newbies commit, Lol
    1. Never ever EVAR say the word SEVEN out loud at the table....say The Devil instead

    2. If the stickman doesn't have the dice in the crook of his croupier stick?
    Get yer Feckin' hands above and behind the padded portion of the rail
    (The same superstition that dictates that saying seven brings a 7 also says dice hitting
    hands or chips brings a 7... and possibly a commensurate beating to the bastard who broke a rule
     
  3. ngrund

    ngrund Low-Roller

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  4. vegasvic

    vegasvic VIP Whale

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    Press usually means double it. If you don't want to double your bet you have to be specific. Let's say you have $12 on the 6 and it hits. You want to go to $18 you don't say press or the dealer will think you want to go to $24. Just say something like, "give me an $18 12. Do it before he pays you.
     
  5. Piggylane

    Piggylane Well-Known Member

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    I learned first by reading a book or two, watching lots of craps games then jumping into the action on a slow table at the Orleans with very surly dealers and players. Highly do not recommend the Orleans to learn craps, the tolerance for amateurs over there for some reason is minimal. I got yelled at for betting too slow, for betting incorrectly and at times just for breathing I think. Good thing I have thick skin!

    I've found Luxor and Excalibur much friendlier to newer players for some reason. I've helped many over the years and I've seen the dealers take a few moments to help with helping them bet. However, it's best to learn table etiquette.

    1. When you walk up to the table the dealer is likely to ask you to color in - exchange your hard earned cash for chips. They will have to stop the hand (the roll) to do this. Please ask them to wait. The shooter may be on a roll. If the shooter is attempting to make a point you may be the one to break his momentum and concentration. Yeah, I know this is a bit of superstition but I think it is rude to stop the game just because you showed up.

    2. Same rule applies for coloring your chips up. Let's say you place a $1 chip on the 12 and it hits. You get $30. You decide to parlay it meaning you leave the bet for another roll. The shooter rolls another 12! Now you have $900! It would be rude for you to stop the game and ask for all of your chips to be colored up. Hold them in the tray until either the point is made or the 7 is rolled.

    3. Bet quickly and clearly. The dealers are pros and know what to do. Decide beforehand what you want to do. If you want to bet $30 on the 8, have $30 ready. Don't say $30 on the 8 and then try to find a green and red chip, the stick man may be pushing the dice to the shooter and you may end up hitting them mid-air and we all know the usual result of that: 7.

    4. If you are going to observe a game, do so from a comfortable distance. Don't crowd a busy table. The players might think you are stealing your chips! Also watch your own chips. There are chip thieves, pickpockets, purse thieves, etc. I've never had no seen anything but heard from others about incidents.

    5. Lastly, a craps table is likely manic-depressive. It's either the noisiest place in the casino because somebody is on a heater or the quietest because the Devil is making his 1/6 appearance far too often. That's the nature of craps. Enjoy the high points, get out when the lows arrive!

    Please tell us about your adventures in craps! We'd all be interested in learning your experiences!
     
  6. LV_Bound

    LV_Bound VIP Whale

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    1. You can only place a pass / don't pass bet when the shooter is doing the Come Out roll....
    Yes, unless you opt to play the Come, Don't Come which is a another aspect of the game that you can learn about at a later time.

    2. If the Come Out roll is 4,5,6,8,9 or 10 then nobody wins or loses on the pass / don't pass bets and the number rolled become the Point. This I get. What happens to the pass / don't pass bets?
    The next time that Point number is rolled (before a 7) then the Pass Line bet gets paid even money. Its the chips placed behind the Pass Line best that gets paid via the odds.
    If a 7 is rolled before the Point then the Don't Pass players get paid.

    3. If the shooter rolls a point, then it moves on to the Point part of the round. Do players then need to bet on the Come / Don't Come to choose whether the shooter will roll the point or roll a 7? Or can players who have already got a bet on Pass / Don't Pass leave their original bet live and not bother betting on Come / Don't Come?

    Leave the Pass LIne bet alone. Place extra chips behind that bet to cover the odds bet. Don't worry about the Come/Don't Come for now.


    4. Can I elect to gamble but avoid being the shooter or would that be classed as bad etiquette?
    Yes, but I strongly suggest you give it a try. Be forewarned though if you go on a heater you will be instantly hooked on the game.
    For a first time shooter even hitting a point or two will get them hooked.

    5. Do I place my chips directly onto the table for whatever I'm gambling on, or do I need to tell the dealers what I'm betting on and/or get them to place my bets for me?
    You control the Pass/Don't Pass, odds, Field and Come/Don't Come bets.
    To place a bet on a specific number, C/E or hard-ways or actually any bet in the middle of the table then toss your chips on the table and call out your bet.
    Toss a $25 chip toward the dealer and say $12 6 & 8. He will place $12 on the 6 and $12 on the 8 and give you $1 back.
    Toss $2 on the table and say $2 hard 6.
    ***Don't toss them a $25 chip and ask for change then place a bet.
    Or toss a $5 and ask for ones. Instead just place a bet and they will give you change back.
    Toss a $5 chip down and say $2 hard 6 and they will give you $3 back***

    6. As a newbie, am I right in assuming it looks better to bet on Pass and Come as opposed to Don't Pass and Don't Come as betting against the Shooter could make me look like a bit of an arsehole?
    This is a touchy subject and gets debated all the time.
    All I will say is that betting the Pass is a lot more fun and exciting at the table then betting the Don't Pass.


    7. Once the Point has been established, does the Shooter keep rolling until he rolls the point or a 7? If he hits the Point can he elect to start a new round again or is it mandatory that the die is passed on to the next player clockwise?


    He continues to roll until he sevens out. Keep in mind if there is no point, I can roll a bunch of 7s which win.
    The shooter only stops tossing if he rolls a 7 while a point is ON.

    8. What does the term "press" mean?
    Press can be used different ways.
    If I have $30 on the 6 and a 6 is rolled I get $35 back.
    You can say Press, but then the dealers may be a bit uncertain what you mean because usually Press is followed by Press 1 (take $6 of the winnings and put toward the bet to make it $36 and pay me $29), Press 2 (take $12 of the winnings and put toward the bet to make it $42 and pay me $23, Press 3 units....
    If you want to put all the winnings toward another bet say Parlay.

    Final suggestion.
    Find a fairly empty table.
    If the table is packed, just go to the casino next door and those tables may be empty.
    Tell the dealers you are new and they will be happy to help.
    Toss a $1 or two out there for the dealers as bets. They will appreciate it and will be more apt to help you.
    Make a $1-$2 hard way bet for them.
     
  7. Aces and Eights

    Aces and Eights VIP Whale

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    If the point is already established (puck is showing "ON" on one of the point numbers: 4, 5, 6, 8, 9, or 10) when you join the table, you are able to make a "Pass-Line" bet along with odds, because the house has even a greater edge. However, you cannot make a "Don't Pass" bet. But the best thing to do is put your bet on the "Come" (or "Don't Come) or wait until the next come-out roll (the puck is showing "OFF"). You can always make "Place" bets. But don't make the "Place" bet just before a come-out roll.

    Just a tidbit of information. Some of the "Prop" bets (the ones in the middle of the table handled by the stickman), may say the payoff as either "X for 1" or "X to 1" where X is a number depending on what you're betting on. Let's say X = 10. "10 for 1" means you will get paid $9 for every $1 you bet (dollar number 10 is your $1 bet). "10 to 1" means you will get $10 for every $1 you bet. Some of the bets are single-roll bets. Some are until a certain number comes up. All these "Prop" bets can be taken down any time even though they will leave it there after you win. If you want it taken down, just tell them, and they will give you your bet back. The same goes for "Place" bets. People usually don't take the bets down after they've made them. On the come-out roll the stickman will usually ask if you want the "Hard-Ways" working or "Off." Just tell them "Hard-Ways working" or "Hard-Ways off" on the come-out. Many people take the "Hard-Ways" bet "Off" on the come-out. FYI: all the "Prop" bets are bad bets with high house-advantage, especially the "Any Seven" bet.

    Try to get a Craps software game. Keep in mind the amount that you can make on the "Odds" bet may vary just as they do between casinos.
     
  8. gadgets19

    gadgets19 Tourist

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    Since you are staying at NYNY they have free craps lessons. I believe it is everyday at 11:00.
     
  9. boofmichael

    boofmichael Low-Roller

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    Thanks guys, this has all been very helpful. I think I'll definitely sign up for the craps lessons at 11:00.

    Wizard of Odds has an emulator which I'm going to use to practice.
     
  10. 44inarow

    44inarow VIP Whale

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    The two things I'll add are:

    (1) You can definitely place a pass line bet after a point is set, but don't do it. As mentioned above, they allow it because it gives the house a higher edge. Ordinarily , if a 7 (or an 11) is rolled on the come-out, you automatically win. That's not the case if the point is already set, so you're losing out on a not-insubstantial portion of your expected winnings.

    (2) It's very much acceptable to pass, and to be totally honest, if you're not sure of what you're doing or just want to observe (while betting), that might be preferable. That way you don't have to worry about slowing down the game, not shooting properly (i.e., not hitting the back of the table, flinging the dice off the table, etc.). And there are other considerations, too. I've been playing craps for over a decade and I still pass sometimes, such as if I think other shooters are going to be luckier... I'd rather an attractive girl who's never played before take the dice ahead of me any day.
     
  11. Badger31

    Badger31 Low-Roller

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    I recommend downloading an app for your smart phone or iPad and practicing on there. That's what I did to familiarize myself with the different kinds of bets

    The only thing you don't get, is the etiquette piece which a lot of people have already posted about.
     
  12. 44inarow

    44inarow VIP Whale

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    That, and the specific multiples you need for certain bets. An app will let you bet anything on the 6/8 place, for example, but because it pays out at 7:6, you really need to bet in multiples of 6. Similarly, because the odds bet pays out 3:2 on a 5/9, you should keep it at an even number, which is important if you're at a $5 or $15 table. But any good dealer will remind you of that.
     
  13. Hobofrank

    Hobofrank Prime Minister of Idiocracy

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    He said he's using the simulator of Wizardofodds.com
    that one doesnt have C&E bets....but who cares?
     
  14. MMMMickey

    MMMMickey Tourist

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  15. mrem3200

    mrem3200 High-Roller

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    I would agree with this. People pass on their turn to roll all the time, no big deal at all. It can be intimidating the first time but after that it is a blast. There isn't much to worry about, just don't touch the dice with both hands, don't blow on them like you see on TV and make sure you hit the back wall and you will be fine. Good luck.
     
  16. makikiboy

    makikiboy VIP Whale

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    I've seen shooters pass the dice even though they didn't seven out.

    One time a shooter was playing the don't. Unfortunately he kept making his points (much to his dismay). Everyone else was cheering while he had a sour face. After he hit his third point (after shooting for about 20 minutes) he put down the dice and said that he was done shooting. The next shooter took up the dice and started rolling, all bets were still on the table (except for the new pass line bets). I thought it funny that the shooter kept playing the dark side even though he was hitting his point but guess he doesn't like playing the positive side.

    Another time a shooter had a prior commitment so when his friends came by to get him he just said that he had to go. He was in the middle of the roll and so the next shooter took up the dice and his point. I don't remember how long he took before he sevened out but I think he hit one or two more points before then.

    As for throwing the dice or not, I know some people don't like to throw the dice and so just pass it to the next person. I will also pass the dice if I didn't have a good shooting day. No problem, the next guy just takes up the dice to shoot.

    As others mentioned, I would recommend attending those craps lessons just to get a feel of the game and have someone show you how to play the game. The good thing with those lessons is after they finish the lesson they will let you actually play the game but possibly with lower minimums (usually $5 minimums) for a bit, just until you can get acquainted with the game.
     
  17. undathesea

    undathesea Grandissimo

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    Just to re-emphasize one thing... you can always put down a passline bet and always pick up a don't passline bet... because it's in the casino's best interest to allow you to do it. Which means it's in your best interest not to do it. Use the Come and Don't Come mid roll.

    And, if you want to color-in, just drop your money on the table closest to you and they'll give you chips when they can get it to it. Never try to hand money to the dealers. It has to be spread on the table and counted out for the cameras.

    The best way to bet for the dealer is placing a two-way bet (one bet for you and one bet for the dealer). So, tossing the stick two dollars and calling out for a two-way hard 8 is a one dollar bet for you and a one dollar bet for the dealer.

    A lesson is fine but playing is the best way to learn. You'll pick up on things quickly... especially when you lose. While losing tends to hurt the most, those are the lessons that people remember the best.
     
  18. Darreningreenwood

    Darreningreenwood Low-Roller

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    As I tell my friends when they make a comment about it being too complicated: it's only intimidating at first; but you focus on one or two things and don't worry about the rest. No matter how much you practice on a computer or app, it's nothing like being at the table. Etiquette and such has been covered here, so I think you'll do fine.

    My two cents: start slow, just making a pass line bet, and then remember to then put some odds behind it. Make sure you get used to putting the right amount for your odds bet. Know that if the point is 5 or 9, the odds must be an even number. No $5 odds bet behind a $5 pass line bet! Classic rookie mistake that you WILL make. But because you've done research, you'll understand why the dealer is telling you to "add a dollar" to your odds bet.

    Once you're comfortable with pass line and odds, then go ahead and place a bet on the 6 and/or 8. Remember, this is the bet that must be a multiple of 6. Another rookie mistake I've seen is people making a $5 place bet on the 6. Most of the time the dealer will correct them. Again, you've done you'll research, so you'll just say "whoops" and throw the dealer a dollar. No fuss, no muss, no holding things up.

    Pass line w/odds, and place bets on the 6 and 8 are your bread and butter. Focus on those and you've got 95% of the game covered. Don't worry about the horn high yo's, all the hard ways-two ways, fire bets, or anything else that people are screaming about.

    At first, you'll feel like you can hardly get your odds down or your bet placed before the next roll of the dice. But soon, you'll feel like everyone else is slowing things down. And then you can throw out the occasional come bet, or whatever else floats your boat.
     
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