Discussion in 'Table Games' started by emeraldsky, Mar 20, 2016.
Can someone explain, in simple language, exactly what this is? Thanks so much.
The 'converted come bet' is a method of playing 3 numbers. The first number is played by making a pass line bet and then placing the odds after a point is established. The second number is played by waiting for the dice to hit another point number and then making a place bet on it for the full amount of your pass line bet and the odds you would normally play with it. The third number is played the same way as the second.
Here is a scenario:
You decide to play a $10 game with 3x odds.
The first roll is a 5. You have your $10 on the pass line and you place $30 in odds for a total bet on the 5 of $40.
The next roll is a 4. You place the 4 for the total of $40.
The next roll is an 8. You place the 8 for $40.
That is the essence of the converted come bet. The logic being that even though each roll is completely random, in true random nature, numbers tend to 'clump' together. Like flipping a coin you might get 11 tails in a row. So although you're not placing a come bet, you're following the dice with your place bets.
*note in this example that you would 'buy' the 4.
*note in this example that you would play the 8 for $42
Uh. I think I understand. I'd go to my local casino and ask but I have a feeling I'll lose and I need all my Canadian $ for Vegas. Plus the minimum is $20.00. Which is ridiculous
So I "play" the points instead of playing the Come bet?
You are making place bets...you are not putting any money in the COME area...you would make a PLACE bet immediately AFTER whichever number (4,5,6,8,9,10) was rolled, in an amount that equals, more or less, the total of your pass line and odds bet...
But, don't you lose out on not having the odds bet for that number?
I think the logic behind this is the notion that when a come bet moves to a number, you only get paid even money if it hits, whereas a place or a buy bet pays better. But if you do this, you give up the payout the come bet gives you on a 7 or 11 while it's in the come box. I don't know what the math says about which is a better proposition.
correct me if I am wrong here, but I think the idea is to avoid the potential loss from the 2,3,12 in the Come box. If you play the come, the assumption would be you would take odds on that bet once it moves to the point, so the come vs place would be a wash. I haven't done the math either.
Yeah, that's the flip side of the come bet.
Not to mention that the come bet number needs to show twice to get paid. Place bets pay on the first hit. Come bets are good for money mgt., if the 7 shows up sporadically, come bets in the come box get paid even money, a small but welcome win despite everything else coming down.
Converted come method is good for warm tables and of course will do well at hot tables. Choppy tables, not so much. But then again, no betting method does well with choppy tables, the worst and most common condition when playing craps.
Uh, what is being called a "converted come bet" is actually a PLACE bet....the term "converted come bet" is a bit of a misnomer...instead of the player pre-determining what number to place bet, the player is letting the dice determine the number, then making a place bet on the number that was just rolled....e.g., if you made a $10 COME bet and a 5 was rolled, your $10 COME bet would be moved to the 5, assuming you made 2X odds ($20), you would have a total of $30 at risk....someone making a "converted come bet" (PLACE bet), could place bet the 5 for $30....if the subsequent roll was another 5, the payout for the come bet would be $40 total....the payout for the "converted come bet" (PLACE bet) would be $42 (a place bet on the number 5 pays $7 per $5 bet)..
Why would you not just bet the come?
Yeah, seems like a great idea... have your $30 face a 4% house edge instead of a 0.6% house edge so you can win an extra $2 if it hits.... :confused2:
The 'converted come bet' is just another system of betting. Like all systems at the craps table, it is a mathematical failure compared to pass line with odds followed by come bet with odds. There is no betting system that is mathematically better than simple pass line/ come (actually don't pass/ don't come is better but the slight edge isn't worth losing the fun factor over).
Don't think that .04 difference is important? The casino that you're standing in, complete with all the marble floors, cathedral ceilings and chandeliers, free rooms and cleaning/wait staff was built with it.
I'm not a stat person....but, if a place bettor is getting paid MORE than a come bettor, while having the same amount of money at risk, then the stats mean very little in the short run...it's sometimes known as gambling...
They are getting paid more but what you are missing on the come bet is that you have the advantage on the come out roll. Some of the complaints about come bets is that they have to hit twice to pay so bet a place bet and if the number hits once you get paid. Well in the converted come bet scenario you are defeating that advantage because they will have to hit twice before you get paid as well.
Numbers don't lie. Anecdotal stories and "what if's" don't change the numbers or the house edge. Any system can win in the short term of course. You could play nothing but hardways and have some winning sessions. That doesn't mean it's a good way to play. Come bets with odds are mathematically superior to place bets. That's indisputable. It's not a large difference but it is a difference. Personally I make place bets rather than come bets. That's because I enjoy that way of playing more, not because I think place bets are mathematically superior. They aren't.
One notion is you have more control with Place bets.
On the come out roll, you can only turn off your odds bet with a Come bet, but make all place bets off (which they are by default).
I also like the fact that you can take back your place bets at any time, whereas you can only take back your odds on come bets, leaving the original come get on the table.
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