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Table Games BJ/Bac players: Is this how you win?

Discussion in 'Table Games' started by fadetheseven, Aug 7, 2014.

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  1. fadetheseven

    fadetheseven High-Roller

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    I'm mostly a dice player but have dabbled in BJ in the past. I just got back from a trip where the 2 most profitable sessions were from ridiculously lucky Hail Mary BJ sessions, where I basically parlayed several wins in a row when I was near bust. Most of my less aggressive BJ sessions were either breakeven or a slow grinding loss. Is this how most of you card players win, or is it more of a steady process?

    edit: here is a link to an example of my hail mary in one of the sessions this past trip http://www.vegasmessageboard.com/forums/showthread.php?110286-Reno-911-Craps-on-Fiya!-Aug-5-7-Atlantis&p=997016#post997016
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2014
  2. paperposter

    paperposter VIP Whale

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    no we hope and pray we get winning hands ,its all in the cards and pray the dealer bust and i make my splits and doubles
     
  3. fadetheseven

    fadetheseven High-Roller

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    Of course you need hands or dealer busts to win. I'm asking if it's usually a grind it out vs hail mary situation that most often leads to winning sessions.
     
  4. firstkill

    firstkill High-Roller

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    I grind, and press when I feel like im "due to catching the streak" IMO flat betting grind or going up and down 1-2 units wont get you far.

    hopefully you catch 3-4 in a row and your doubles/splits and have the guts to press. I like to win large, do I normally don't "regress" my bets.

    fk
     
  5. jdvegas

    jdvegas VIP Whale

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    I press when I win - sometimes very aggressively. But I don't do "Hail Mary" betting - that smacks of chasing losses.
     
  6. gambler

    gambler VIP Whale

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    I think I get what you mean about Hail Mary.

    It's mostly a grind to me. But sometimes you get that first Hail Mary and it gives you confidence to split and double down because now you have the bankroll to back you up.

    Lots of player's play great basic strategy but if they've gone to a table with $100 and find themselves in a position to (correctly) split and then double a couple times, they will not risk $40 out of their $100 to gamble. That's a mistake. That hand offering splits and double downs is statistically more profitable (and more likely to win) than their next 4 hands.

    You have to be aggressive to win in BJ and for many, the Hail Mary gives them the confidence and bankroll to try that.

    But to answer your question - It's usually boom or bust for me.
     
  7. pphold

    pphold pp Park Place Degenerate

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    I don't do Hail Marys either.

    BEST thing to do is Press when you are winning and flat bet min when you are losing. Gambling is in streaks so Press and be aggressive on the winning and flat bet min on the losing.

    Now If I can only follow my own advice.

    Mostly just have fun. My rule is you come to casino to have fun if you are not having fun LEAVE.
     
  8. fadetheseven

    fadetheseven High-Roller

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    Hail Mary is too vague and could mean many things to different people. My version came at the end of a session when I was either ready to go eat (retained 50% of buy in) or almost bust (parlay every win with last few remaining flat bets). I saw plenty of people go all in after just sitting down.

    I don't have anything against chasing losses because as gamblers we are usually behind and trying to climb out of a hole. At least that's how most of my trips go, but I don't usually randomly bet huge for an entire session.
     
  9. topcard

    topcard Older than the Stardust!

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    Slow grind...but ususually an upward grind!
     
    Finally have the room booked! Look for me Feb 21-23
  10. fadetheseven

    fadetheseven High-Roller

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    Saw few angry gamblers as well. Old guy would curse and slam the felt when he got felted. Problem was that he kept rebuying so was getting felted repeatedly. He finally left and the dealer and I were talking about how miserable he must be in real life. He was a local/regular and the dealer responded, "yeah, you should see how he treats his wife." I think most people that are angry gamblers probably have similar behavior in other aspects of their lives. Either that or they feel entitled to win and have a tantrum when they don't. This was the dealer's theory.
     
  11. fadetheseven

    fadetheseven High-Roller

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    edited first post with link to an example of what I meant by Hail Mary.
     
  12. dutchvelvet

    dutchvelvet VIP Whale

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    I'll understand "Hail Mary" as making a bet more than 4x what I'm flat betting.

    I only do it on a win or change. I almost always buy in in multiples of 1000. If I get up to 2x my buy in I'll color up a yellow and keep playing. If I get up to 3x I'll stop

    Sometimes what will happen is I'll play $50s ffor a few hours off a 1k buy in and have something like 1600 left when I need to go. If that occurs and I'm feeling lucky, I'll sometimes put up a $400 bet so if I win I cash out at two yellows. I'll never hail mary in BJ unless i have enough to cover a double or split. I do it actually more in Pai Gow Poker, where variance is pretty low and running about even is pretty common. When you win that hand it is great, when you lose, you're about even. I refuse to "hail mary" on a loss, as that is how you start getting in trouble trying to get back to even.
     
  13. Chuck2009x

    Chuck2009x VIP Whale

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    Press when you're up, be lucky when you press, and walk away up. That's the only way to win a substantial amount at any table game without making carny bets.
     
  14. Husky206Pride

    Husky206Pride Tourist

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    Every once in a while I'll do a hail mary, but usually only if I have been drinking AND losing. Normally I play strict basic strategy and use a 1-2-3 unit betting strategy. So it's a $10 table and I win my first hand, I go up to $20. If I win that one, I go to $30. Whether I win or lose the $30 bet, I start over at $10. And whenever I lose any bet, I go back to $10.
     
  15. chonglosaxon

    chonglosaxon MIA

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    A buddy of mine will bet half his bankroll on the first hand he plays when he comes with me to Vegas. His bankroll is substantial, sometimes he wins, sometimes he loses but it dictates the way he plays the rest of the way. He has had some big wins and has lost his whole bankroll on many occassions but overall, he has done pretty well.
     
  16. dutchvelvet

    dutchvelvet VIP Whale

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    Will he double on 11?
     
  17. chonglosaxon

    chonglosaxon MIA

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    He doubled once. 10 vs 4 and won.
     
  18. Gamesman

    Gamesman VIP Whale

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    Interesting. Does he just walk up to a table and drop out down or does he watch it first?
     
  19. RockyBalboa

    RockyBalboa VIP Whale

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    I understand what Phat is saying and I attribute it to just being aggressive and in that mindset that you're going to press like hell.

    Sometimes it works out and other times its busto. However it illustrates how quickly you can rake in a pile of chips.

    I sat down once at a $50 blackjack table on the way up to the room. I was going to take that $400 and be aggressive with it or I'd be going to bed. I ended up cashing out with $2400.
     
  20. fadetheseven

    fadetheseven High-Roller

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    I think you've stated what I meant to say in the OP. Since I got back yesterday I've been thinking how insanely lucky you have to be just randomly step on the gas and win big. It's stories like yours and the one I experienced yesterday that makes me want to try this at least at the end of a trip. Take a small stake relative to total bankroll and take a flyer by pressing hard on each win. I've experienced the downside of pressing aggressively (not parlays) for an entire trip.
     
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