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Are we just that unlucky?

Discussion in 'Casino Gaming' started by weluvvegas, Sep 3, 2013.

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  1. wrxrob

    wrxrob High-Roller

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    no handpays in Vegas. Only one trip out of a dozen did I truly come out ahead. Played WOF $5 machine, and hit $1195, then $1,000 the very next day.

    At home casinos I've had a few extraordinary hand-pays ($5K on nickel machine, $2K on penny machine), but realize that I have lost FAR MORE money over the years at the local casinos, enough to warrant consideration of giving it up altogether.
     
  2. USCHawks

    USCHawks High-Roller

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    I've yet to receive a hand pay, but I'm not really expecting it either. I usually only play quarter 3-reel machines or video slots between $0.50-$1.00 per bet. Even at a $1 bet it would take a win of 1200x my bet.
     
  3. 2VegasNuts

    2VegasNuts High-Roller

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    Interesting reading. My Las Vegas "career" began in 1983 when I left college to travel around the country. During my cruise through Nevada, I met a dealer at The Frontier who introduced me to William Morris, owner of The Landmark hotel. I started playing BJ (90% of gambling) and Slots at that time. From 1983 until 2009 I had never gotten a hand pay. This was with some good slot play at .25c and $1. That was good slot play back then. Hand pays may have been less back then but I never got one of any kind. In 1998, my slot play increased. BJ was still king and my AB was $400+/hand, but I was pushing several thousand through slots every day. Mostly at NYNY, HL room, Cleopatra/Unicorn...Ug (min $9/spin)

    Now for the good part. In 2009, we spent New Years at the newly opened Aria. I hit 2 hand pays during the 1st hour. Yeah! After 26 years it was about time. One was a $2.50 max bet machine ($1250) in front of the players club, the other a 9 credit .25c Top Dollar Machine ($2100) just to the left of the players club as you face it (both machines still there today). From that point, the flood gates have opened up. Playing not much more than .25c (10 credit min), $1 (3-9 credit), and now a few $5 slots I have gotten about 40 hand pays. That's over 20-25 trips, but still one heck of a lot better than 0.

    So, as gamblers anonymous told me..."Just keep playing, you're bound to win soon"
     
    Last edited: Sep 3, 2013
  4. Auggie

    Auggie Dovahkiin

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    There are lots of people who have never hit a hand pay and they wonder why... but for many of them the reason they've never hit a hand pay is because they never can hit a hand pay or their chances of doing so are extremely high.

    If three reel slots are you thing:
    At the 50c level or lower most of these slots can't trigger a hand pay - they just don't pay out enough even if you hit the top jackpot. There are a few that can and some that are linked to progressive jackpots.
    Even at the $1 level, many $1 slots will only do a hand pay if you hit the top jackpot.

    If you are in to video slots instead:
    For the more classic style penny slot machines they will often say right on the front of the machine something like "TOP JACKPOT OF _____ CREDITS" or "MAX PRIZE OF ______ CREDITS" and often this max jackpot is between 75,000 to 110,000 credits...
    On a penny machine a top jackpot of 110,000 credits is $1,100 - not enough for a hand pay, and to get that you have to be betting all lines and max credits (usually $2-5 per spin)
    Even the new video slots with their super high variances and lots of stacked symbols and extra wilds and all that even they have a hard time getting over the $1000 mark and that still will take a max bet and a whole lotta luck.


    My suggestion is: the next time you are at the casino, either local or in Vegas, stop for a moment and take a look at the pay tables for the machines you like to play the most and with your knowledge of the game and your bet level you should be able to deduce if you can even hit a handpay or not.

    Like a game I like to play five of a kind of the top symbol pays 1,000 credits and max bet on this machine is 8 credits and technically if I was really lucky I could see that top symbol being paid up to 6 times on one spin...
    The math says: 1000 * 8 * 6 = 48,000
    Since this is a penny machine that means my best win would be $480... just about the best possible outcome for me on this machine is only about a third of a way to a hand pay in a US casino.


    All that said: for lower limit slots the games are actually designed that way, where a hand pay is either impossible or the odds of one are astronomically high.

    Some reasons for this are:
    -> Americans have to declare gambling winnings as income and getting a hand pay creates a paper trail of winnings you will have to declare
    -> Some foreign players will be subject to a witholding tax if they get a hand pay which might keep them either way from US casinos or keep their bets small when they could be playing bigger
    -> For the casinos the more hand pays going on the more staff they require to run around handling hand pays and the more players that end up sitting around waiting for a pay and their paperwork.
     
  5. bardolator

    bardolator Lifelong Low Roller

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    I play slots rarely and low, so I will never hit a hand pay on a slot.

    For several years in the previous decade, Barbary Coast offered a VP payout of $1199 on quarters (the normal hit is $1000). It wasn't a progressive- it was always available. The goal was to attract players but avoid paperwork. I frequently play 50 cents or a buck video poker, but have never hit a royal at any level in well over 100,000 hands of play.

    The other games I play don't expose me to the W2G.
     
  6. JosieCat

    JosieCat VIP Whale

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    I've hit hand-pays in Vegas, but not lately. We've been going to Vegas for a long time, and it used to be that we would hit at least one on a trip (and that was with a much smaller bankroll). But out of my last 6 trips (2 at Aria, 2 at Bellagio 1 at Mirage and 1 at MGM), I've only hit one - for the bare minimum of $1,200. I guess we chalk it up to the machines we are playing. We don't spend nearly as much time on the 3 reel machines as we used to. It's funny, because playing machines like Life of Luxury and Siberian Storm - we hit hand-pays on them locally, but NEVER in Vegas. And we aren't playing 50 cents a spin - we are playing from $3-$5 a spin.
     
  7. weluvvegas

    weluvvegas Casino Countess

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    Really good stuff. As much as I'd love a handpay, I'd just love to hit something substantial. I've hit that one $300 on the Majestic Lions from my mother's $20 bill but other than that, the most I can really remember walking away from one machine with is maybe $100 or so over what I put in when I sat down. Anything more than that would be nice.

    I've gone to some of the penny slots and thought...I'm going to max bet and see what happens. What happened? I ran out of money in less than 10 minutes, that's what happened. LOL

    I've got some freeplay coming from the Mirage with my room so I think I'll use that to play a higher denom slot this time and see if it pays off at all.

    Thank you all for joining me in my pity party. This morning I was on my way to work and I came to a red light. This particular light you can go left and then make a right and end up in the same spot as if you went straight and curved around. The thing with this light is that you never know which one will turn green first. The turn lane or the one that goes straight. This morning I thought....just like a gamble, I have a 50/50 shot at picking the one that will turn green first.

    Guess what, I chose wrong. Story of my life!
     
  8. Joe

    Joe VIP Whale

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    After reading through this thread, I must say you people have me thinking my wife and I are lucky SOBs :thumbsup:

    She has had 25 "hand pays" (all Royals) but only two were true hand pays, over $1,199. The rest were all $1,000 Royals on quarter VP, but the places we play still pay you by hand. No TITO.

    I've also had 25 hand pays. 12 were true hand pays, the best one being $6,485, the rest were all $1,000 paid by hand.

    Just to join in the pity party, I haven't had a Royal in 3.5 years, but have hit aces with a kicker 3 times in that stretch on dollars.
     
  9. Electroguy563

    Electroguy563 Vegas Joker

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    I personally rather have a trip where I am consistently hitting pay-outs under $1100.

    I never had a handpay yet, but would hate having handpays that just barely made the minimum. I would rather have 2-$600 dollar wins instead. And do this all day long. No bells or whistles, no attendants hovering for tips, no strangers trying to be your "friend". Just money coming in, slowly but surely. But then I'm considered a low roller and play quarter and dollar machines if I'm not at the craps table.

    Playing at this level is where minimum handpays are highly likely, which I dread, but this is my gambling comfort level.

    Of course huge handpays like Lion share or Mega-bucks is different, lol!
     
  10. shifter

    shifter Degenerate Gambler

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    yep, that sucks. with the very limited slots I play I've hit 2 handpays and they were for $1400 and $1300. would have rather hit for $1199 and not had the handpay. now if it's $5k or something, then that's great.
     
  11. kboltwkreations

    kboltwkreations Low-Roller

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    I agree with you here. Steady low dollar wins are just as exciting to me as handpay.
    I was playing a $5 machine locally a few weeks ago and it would not let the machine hold over $1000 worth of credits. I had it built up high and it kept spitting out all tickets that put it over $1000... that was really exciting!
     
  12. bardolator

    bardolator Lifelong Low Roller

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    Right- since I've never had one, I forgot that you can have a hand pay without a W2G if you hit a quarter VP royal. Maybe that sort of blatant money grab deserves its own acronym. Instead of TITO, it could be TIHO- ticket in, hand out.
     
  13. Chuck2009x

    Chuck2009x VIP Whale

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    A lot of people have given answers that are valid.

    There's so much that goes into it.

    If you think about it, the odds of getting a handpay on a given machine are probably related to its volatility. Play a machine that churns out steady small or medium wins and you're less likely to hit a jackpot.

    The biggest jackpot I ever hit was $1,250 on a $3 max Wizard of Oz, so that represents about 400x.

    Ever hit a win on a slot that paid 400x your bet? You probably have.
     
  14. weluvvegas

    weluvvegas Casino Countess

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    Actually I never bet less than $.60 a spin so...that would be $240 and I've never hit for that much on one machine (except for that Majestic Lions) I guess the closest would be I put in a $5 into that big Bally's/Paris slot and won $150.

    My husband did hit today for $60 playing $.25 on a penny Hot Shot so that's not bad.
     
  15. Grid

    Grid Well-Known Member

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    I am not a High Roller at all. I only bankroll $300-$400.00 per day when I am in vegas. I play for 3 or 4 days tops. Now I only play slots and I top out around $1.00-$2.00 per spin on pennies or nickles. And $3.00-$5.00 per on dollars. Quarters are always low like .50 or .75 for max bet. And I average about 6 $100.00+ hits per trip. I take pictures of them all and document them on my website in trip reports. Normally I get at least something in the $200- $300 range per trip. My most being almost $11K.

    Looking at past trips from 2002-2008 I was hitting a lot more and my money really seemed to last. The past 5 years my bankroll has been drying up. I just think its the types of machines that are out there now. And gamblers being accustomed to 88% payback as the norm. 10 years ago it was around 93% for slots in Vegas. I miss those times.

    So for you to never hit anything over $300 and you play some dollar machines. Thats pretty shitty luck!
     
  16. weluvvegas

    weluvvegas Casino Countess

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    Are you playing a lot of old-style 3 reel slots? What are your favorite ones to play - do the same types seem to pay out better than others for you?
     
  17. saintpauljeff

    saintpauljeff VIP Whale

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    geez, $300/$400 per day would last me an hour of gambling the way my luck works at slot machines, the $1 WOF slot sucks it down so quick its not even funny
     
  18. Kickin

    Kickin Flea

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    Since you're a gambler you should know all this means is that you're due! So hit the casinos asap. :poke:

    Hopefully your lack of handpays will make your first handpay a monster one. Not these $1250 pieces of bullshit I keep getting on VP.
     
  19. xizor

    xizor Tourist

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    Add me to the list of never had a hand pay.
    Sounds like an excuse to book a quick trip weekend after next and learn to play VP :peace:
     
  20. da1chifan

    da1chifan High-Roller

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    Yep. I've been 14-16 times in the last 7 years and neither of us have had a handpay. Just switched to mostly VP this last trip, so maybe that will help.

    Going to try again in October.....
     
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