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Affects BS the comps i get

Discussion in 'Comps' started by Rheuma-Kai, Feb 1, 2013.

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  1. Rheuma-Kai

    Rheuma-Kai Newbie

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    Hi everyone, im new at the forum. Greets from Germany.

    Normally i go twice a year to vegas, mostly 10-14 days, only gaming, trying not to leave the city:drunk:. I go with a buddy, we play 8-10 hours a day BJ, 50-100$ the hand. We we´re both platinum at Mlife, but with the new system i think we dont gonna make it.

    My question: Does the way, i play BJ (BS, with mostly no errors, i think!!) affect the amount of comps, i get? Does the casino or the pitboss take notice, that i play BS and rate this in the programm.

    Does anybody know that? I hope i explained it so you can understand the question.
     
  2. Llew

    Llew Low-Roller

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    Every casino is different. Some evaluate your skill and adjust your theoretical loss accordingly, which then affects your comp earning. Others do not differentiate between skill levels. I know for sure that the Aria and the Bellagio do.
     
  3. LAV

    LAV Tourist

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    There will be a couple of people on here who would argue that the casinos do rate you based on skill, thus affecting your theo, but for the most part, most, if not almost all the casinos do not have the human power to implement this.

    The previous poster said that they know for sure that Bellagio and Aria do. I am curious to know about that as well.

    Simply put, just play the way you play and bet the bets you typically make, and let the chips fall where they fall. Don't play with earning comps as the primary focus. Play for leisure and to win. Let the comps come naturally.
     
  4. DonD

    DonD Super Moderator

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    I've seen a rating slip at the El Cortez and they have a skill rating area on them. I've also seen a computer printout at another casino that had the way I bet. It noted me as a press player at BJ.
     
  5. Kickin

    Kickin Flea

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    I think both DonD and Lav are right. The systems I've seen in person and online from the gaming companies all have the ability to track player skill level by either the pit personnel inputting it or automatically if the table has automatic tracking technology. At the Caesars in AC where the computers are connected to the tables right by 3rd base where I usually sit I've seen the screen several times and as far as I can tell it was just a drop down box for player skill but they always had it on "average". So like Lav said, it still depends on a human being caring to put in the extra effort to adjust the level.
     
  6. stackinchips

    stackinchips High-Roller

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    I'm surprised they would bother adjusting it for skill. It seems to me that a casino would just assume everyone is playing optimal BS or close to it, and rate them accordingly. If someone sits down with no clue/care what they are doing, then it's just a bonus for the casino.

    I'd be really surprised if much thought is given to this in most instances, at least outside of the HL rooms. What's the difference for a $5-10 BJ player if we're talking perfect BS vs. a couple mistakes? Maybe 3-4 bucks in theo over an hour? So like a buck in comps? Are you really going to argue with the casino over a buck in comps that you should or should not have gotten? Obviously at higher limits it matters but for 90% of the players in a casino it makes little to no difference and the casino probably treats it as such.
     
  7. LAV

    LAV Tourist

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    Yes, there are definitely areas on the screen for pit bosses to make notes of player. But it's not just for black jack.

    I will give you some examples that have happened where people's ratings, thus, theo were impacted playing baccarat. A husband and wife were betting opposites, one on banker and one on player, to try to earn ratings, etc. Well, the pit bosses picked up on that and made notes accordingly, and the couple got very little ratings. Same thing happened with some Chinese players, who came in a group and did the same thing. They were pooling there money and were betting $7,000 a hand, opposite each other. They were obviously trying to raise their theo and get their airfare reimbursement etc. Guess, what, their theo ended up not being as high as they were shooting for.

    As for blackjack, reading into the statement that you are a "press" player can mean multiple things. It could help the next pit boss who covers the relief have a better idea of your avg. bet. Say your low is like $50/hand. Knowing that you are a press player means that you press when you win/lose and that your avg. should be higher than what they see etc. Nothing unique about saying a player is a press player. Many veteran blackjack players are considered press players anyhow.

    My point is, there are areas for all kinds of notations, etc. Just because something is on the screen or on a printout does not mean it is practical to implement, or even implemented altogether.

    There are many "skilled" bj players who get good comps, and many "poor" players who get excellent comps, based on length of time played and avg. bet.

    Heck, the pit critters are more concerned if you are a card counter than how skillful you are as a bj player.

    Once you are deemed a card counter, no theo or ratings for you on bj.

    However, if you are either a poor, avg, or skilled bj player, there will be comps for you based on your avg bet and time played, period.

    BJ has a lower HA than most table games anyway.
     
  8. nostresshere

    nostresshere Mr. Anti Debit Card

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    I assume all your play is at MGM. They will provide comps based more on your theo, then on the level (Plat). Keep in touch with the host, they should take care of you.
     
  9. Kickin

    Kickin Flea

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    That pit boss doesn't understand simple math and should be let go for risking losing guaranteed losing players.
     
  10. Rheuma-Kai

    Rheuma-Kai Newbie

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    Thanks for all the answers. I dont wanna play for comps but i try to maximize them. I once read a book bout comps that the casino rates the players with a 2% house-advantage, so it would be quite different from the real edge of BS. That would mean BS players are "overcomped". Thought it would be like Stackinchips wrote: It seems to me that a casino would just assume everyone is playing optimal BS or close to it, and rate them accordingly. If someone sits down with no clue/care what they are doing, then it's just a bonus for the casino.

    So if they adjust my comps because of the level i play, perhaps more often change of tabels or hotels would make sense? Because of the length of our stays (10-14 days, 8-10 Hours a day, normally two hotels) and the times we play (very early morning because of the jet lag!), after 3 days, the shift pit boss knows us, the dealers know us, and often there a only a few or no others players, so the can track us the hole time.
     
  11. Nittany1

    Nittany1 VIP Whale

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    Casinos do not assume everyone plays perfect BS.
    I am constanly amazed in Las Vegas,Atlantic City and local casinos the amount of players that play on hunches and violate all BS principles.
    That being said I don't think the players skill level enters that much into the theo calculation unless they are a suspected counter or blatant rookie with no clue of BS
     
  12. Kickin

    Kickin Flea

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    I just spoke with MLife yesterday to get some clarity on my ECs earned last trip. I posted in another thread about how I felt I earned far fewer ECs relative to tier points earned than the math would suggest. Long story short they couldn't give me too much hard data on my play over the phone but they gave me my total base points which were only earned on my machine play (video poker) and since I found out the average bet and hours I played at blackjack before I left the casino I was able to back out the numbers. The only variable I don't know was how many hands per hour they rate at so I just used 100. They said for table play the ECs were equal to 13% of theo. So working backwards the theo they had would only be equal to about 0.3% house edge at blackjack. Way less than I expected they'd use. I played mostly the double deck game at Aria which at optimal play is 0.27%. So it sounds like they used the optimal play number.

    There could still be some mistake, not in the math I did based on the numbers they gave me but just in the overall rating because I still can't reconcile my TCs earned since there isn't any hard data on the rate you earn them for table play, but based on my math and the limited info I have it should be less than what I earned.
     
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